Why does Satanism cause depression in me?

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Original post: Tevnon

For starters I'm not a Satanist, but a chaote(or at very least I'm strongly influenced by Chaos magic) who occasionally has used Satanism as a paradigm.
At various times I've worked with traditional Satanism, LaVey Satanism, and even basic Satanic dabbling as paradigms. Without fail Satanic practice always induces a ceartain amount of depression in me.
I do know that I'm slightly bipolar anyway, but that still doesn't fully explain it. I don't get it. Why can't I use/practice anything Satanic without my mood dropping into a depressed state?

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Original post: 7x5 Blunt

Do you seek acceptance? Are you secure with yourself? Are you strong enough to stand against the entirety of mankind?

Its funny, mainstream religions make me depressed

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Original post: Scarlett_156

I can only speak for myself here.

To be a part of the satanic current is a fiercely joyful experience for me. One of the ways I know I have tapped into that current is that a sudden, almost unbearable exultation will erupt in my heart, blotting out my mind with a light of intense purity, and making whatever action I perform "right" and "good" as long as it is directed by purely selfish motives.

When I'm in that "zone" I often hear a riotous babble of demonic voices, and sometimes also the screams of the damned--not those who have sinned, but those sinners who doubted themselves and pulled back, calling on God at the last moment in their weakness. (Even Jesus himself said: "Be hot or cold--if you are lukewarm I will vomit you out of my mouth." He does sound like a guy who has been to hell! He knew what he was talking about. Demons obeyed him--let me tell you, if you are weak, if you doubt, you will never bend the Fallen to your will!)

But as fun as it is to be in the satanic current, you have to step out of it from time to time if you want for your everyday life on this plane to continue. Coming down from that rush produces an overwhelming depression and a feeling of boredom with ordinary life that is almost unbearable.

Again, this is just me--but it may help you to explain your problem to yourself.

Good luck! xoxoxo

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Original post: mateoflerajie

(Hi I'm new but jumping in) certain work with satan has made me feel depressed in the past. I honestly am not 100% sure why.

I know this might seem wrong to some, but perhaps you could 'have a chat' to him and find out why it is in your case?

Also I find it can be got over a little by 'chatting' with him, finding out his true nature for you. Hope this helps, what limited knowledge I have on the subject

I prefer to work with other demons rather than Satan but maybe that's a matter of temperament, and maybe

oooh I just had a thought. Satan is about being yourself, relaxed. If you have a dislike of yourself or a lot of shame feelings inside it can be depressing to consider 'being yourself'- feel like something blameworthy and shameful in a way. Does that make sense to anyone?

I have had bipolar in the past too. Maybe it is that the idea of acting uniquely/eccentrically as satan might encourage, people with bipolar have been told is a sign they are getting 'ill' or 'mad' even more than most normal people have been told that this is what acting 'differently' would mean

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Original post: m1thr0s

oooh I just had a thought. Satan is about being yourself, relaxed. If you have a dislike of yourself or a lot of shame feelings inside it can be depressing to consider 'being yourself'- feel like something blameworthy and shameful in a way. Does that make sense to anyone?

partially, yes. Eric Fromm is one of my favorite published shrinks. He worked a lot with what he called "existential anxiety"...built a whole school of therapy around it really. Since Satanism is so intensely self-affirming and places so much emphasis on self-reliance etc, it can be psychologically disarming in ways you might not expect going in. It's not an easy thing confronting all of life's complex challenges feeling like maybe you haven't really got anybody in your corner but you. If you're ready for that it can be very exhilarating but I think most people are only intellectually ready for the reality...at an emotional level most people are still sort of hoping to forge an alliance with something bigger and smarter and more powerful than themselves just to help carry the load.

Some forms of Satanism allow for this...but most really don't. I don't know how much that figures into things but I can see where the unspoken realization of this stark solitude could in many cases be a very depressing experience.

m1thr0s

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Original post: LadyHydralisk

For starters I'm not a Satanist, but a chaote(or at very least I'm strongly influenced by Chaos magic) who occasionally has used Satanism as a paradigm.
At various times I've worked with traditional Satanism, LaVey Satanism, and even basic Satanic dabbling as paradigms. Without fail Satanic practice always induces a ceartain amount of depression in me.
I do know that I'm slightly bipolar anyway, but that still doesn't fully explain it. I don't get it. Why can't I use/practice anything Satanic without my mood dropping into a depressed state?

"If you start to go down, GO DOWN, if you start to go up, GO UP...this generates COSMIC MOMENTUM"

- SilentJohn

I love a horrible morbid depression myself, especially when it involves TOTALLY COSMICALLY FRACKED situations that require intense introspective revamps that turn you inside out.

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Original post: Treasure Ra

[QUOTE=m1thr0s;276059]Since Satanism is so intensely self-affirming and places so much emphasis on self-reliance etc, it can be psychologically disarming in ways you might not expect going in. It's not an easy thing confronting all of life's complex challenges feeling like maybe you haven't really got anybody in your corner but you.

m1thr0s[/QUOTE]


..and with the self-affirming and self-reliance comes the realisation that you have complete responsibility for your self. You have to work intensly to identify all your fears and desires, recognise behaviour patterns and be discliplined enough to challenge that which does nothing for your journey to self-deification. There is no external "God" or magical ray of light to "save" you here!
I have found this to be depressing in a transitory way. Yet another issue to deal with - but followed swiftly by the joy and exhilaration which can only come from solitary achievement.
Try looking closely at your depression - keep digging and picking away at it until you know its origin - confont it and heal it. The work is worth it and the high is intense.

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Original post: m1thr0s

Try looking closely at your depression - keep digging and picking away at it until you know its origin - confont it and heal it. The work is worth it and the high is intense.

brilliant...very true. this is sometimes referred to as a "healing crisis" in certain circles. It's a known phenomena, not an isolated thing at all. It even operates on a purely physical level if you were to suddenly start trying very hard to eat only healthy foods for instance. The body will kick up a tremendous fuss...it wants its poisons...it's used to them. But with time and a little backbone it will pass and you'll acclimate to your healthier diet.

depression houses creative genius in no small portion.
the world is kind of a depressing place until you come to some kind of battle terms that work for you.

m1thr0s

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Original post: Tevnon

Thanks everyone for the responces. This is all quite useful. While I primarily seek to be a chaote Satanism is something I definately want to master.

There is one other experiance along these lines which I found interesting. For a while I was reading up on and investing a lot of belief in Satanism, worked a bit of magic, and whatnot. This was only one of such times I did this, but the difference is this time as a chaote I paradigm shifted out of it quickly. This was because I wanted to do some Pagan magic. The shift was accomplished by chanting "I am Pagan and only Pagan" a while with intent.
Two things then happened. The first was my depression lifted quickly. The second was a visual phenomenon which was downright weird. From the top of my visual field I saw a line stretching across my field of sight. Below this line everything looked bland and gloomy as it had before. Everything above it looked crisp, bright, and in focus as though it was at a higher resolution and with greater color contrast and such. The line scrolled down my field of vision until all of my sight was bright and cheery.
Apparently shifting my belief from a totally left hand path paradigm (Satanism) to a fully right hand path belief set (Wicca) was such a radical shift it gave a rather spectracular phsycological result.
I found that surprising.

Edit: Don't take that the wrong way, though. I'm not trying to say Wicca or The Right Hand path is better/more positive an experiance. I've also experianced the joy/pleasure rush of the Satanic current somewhat like Scarlett 156 described. Not everything I've experianced of Satanism has been depressing.

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Original post: Centrix

Depression comes from self-esteem.

Satanism (COS) does away with the concept of self-esteem, self-image, or assigning any value to the Self.

You are a God. You don't evaluate yourself. A lion never judges or questions itself or its existance. It is far more elite in its nature. All it knows is that it exists. It may calculate its actions, however.

Think about that.

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Original post: LadyHydralisk

Depression comes from self-esteem.

Satanism (COS) does away with the concept of self-esteem, self-image, or assigning any value to the Self.

You are a God. You don't evaluate yourself. A lion never judges or questions itself or its existance. It is far more elite in its nature. All it knows is that it exists. It may evaulate its motives, however.

Think about that.

I'm sure there is a lion out there somewhere that questioned itself and was unsure of itself. I've seen animals get depressed. Even big predatory ones (shit, I grew up with timber wolves my whole life)

You can make wide sweeping comments like this that sound grandiose but they're really quite useless in reality once you *do* actually think about it.

Did you just finish watching The Lion King, or something?

Forget it...moving on...

I've observed the lower realms of creation and notice depression is a symptom of connection to these realms. giving in to these feelings and rerouting stuff such as despair, hatred and hopelessness is a clever turn in itself for any magician, and an absolute necessity if you want to connect the above and below. You must pass through the fire.....Abandon All Hope....it's good advice, if you want to break through the gate with ease.

In a certain state of trance I've discovered despair is one of the most beautiful things you can feel when adjusted correctly, anyone who works with the lower realms will know what I'm talking about.

So the cosmic momentum thing is actually a big friggin deal, it's the stuff Hermes talks about in the Emerald Tablet. Hardly anyone realizes this but it doesn't matter. it's there, It's one of the only guides to the macrocosmic rotation out there, at least, that's translated into English.

la la la...

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Original post: Venus666

You know what I would say>? try expanding your awareness of satanism in different directions. Look into aspects of it that are rarely explored. Take a concept and explore it from different sides. The possible combinations are endless.

You do realise that since you use magick, your attitudes will influence the outcomes in your life. Make a commitment not to fall into the same old accepting rut that youve been in before. Something keeps calling you back to satanism, so maybe there is something there that can benefit you.

You are not alone, the use of "dark energies" can and do tend to lead to energy consumption and change in the magickans aura. IN essence, the being becomes changed by the magickan constantly "tuning" into the frequency. You can fight this, or go for it and use it, in the end the choice is up to you.

You have to develop your own self-help methods that will keep you on track, The soultion is there if you seek it and if the time is right for you to act...

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Original post: Treasure Ra

[QUOTE=Tevnon;276107]
Edit: Don't take that the wrong way, though. I'm not trying to say Wicca or The Right Hand path is better/more positive an experiance. .[/QUOTE]

Thank goodness you added that edit, the first bit made me throw up in my mouth a bit!

Seriously, I think everyone is basically saying the same thing from different angles. You simply cannot follow a satanic path unless you do deep hard work on your self. They WILL find evey hidden fear and doubt and use it against you - to make you stronger, more aware. If you aren't up to it, don't commit to the work then you will be broken. Lady hydralisk is correct when she talks about the momentum because the action of discovering emotions and behaviour patterns which block your path to power - thinking you have "finished" = elation. This is inevitably followed by yet another issue to deal with and down you go again!
Centrix is right when he talks about COS and self-esteem ect. except that I think the weakness lies in having any emotional attachment to your baggage - not that you cannot have a self at all (my personal interpretation). M1thr0s is just right!
Enjoy being drawn to satanism, but don't dabble. Use the depression as neon sign pointing to whatever you need to deal with.

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Original post: thethird

[QUOTE=m1thr0s;276059]Since Satanism is so intensely self-affirming and places so much emphasis on self-reliance etc, it can be psychologically disarming in ways you might not expect going in. It's not an easy thing confronting all of life's complex challenges feeling like maybe you haven't really got anybody in your corner but you. If you're ready for that it can be very exhilarating but I think most people are only intellectually ready for the reality...at an emotional level most people are still sort of hoping to forge an alliance with something bigger and smarter and more powerful than themselves just to help carry the load.
[/QUOTE]

Hmm, I never quite put it into words, but I believe you just summed up my fascination with Satanism. I found myself always coming back to the satanism section of the forum, and I never could quite pinpoint why, but it always made me feel more purposeful and on path. It just seemed smarter.

Everyone is always talking about this demon that they love or this one that they hate and this one that does their bidding, etc... but what you just said, that absolute stark and vast approach to spirituality is beautiful.

No one is going to come save you when you mess up, but you. No one is going to keep you company on a sad lonely night, when infinity and pointlessness take turns dancing in your minds eye, except for yourself. And no one is going to come whisper in your ear that you are oh so special, even though all your programing tells you that is what you need.

I guess if you can handle all that, then you can handle almost anything.

Talk about the path of true gods.

Perhaps time is the only thing that will ever cure that depression, because the implications would surely take some getting used to, but once they are understood I'd imagine the self-strength to be massive.

Allright, 100 posts.... and it only took me 2 years.

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Original post: LadyHydralisk

I like to be self sufficient. When I was eight I got sick and tired of people having power over me so that they could control my lifestyle by providing my only means to basic survival, so I decided it is better to know how to do everything by yourself, and to come to understand something on your own terms instead of letting others do things for you.

I would like to be like a snake, self contained, efficient, low to the ground in camo, eyes always open.

But the truth of the matter is I'm more like a Tokay Gecko, bright orange and neon blue, with a nasty disposition and a loud bark backed up with a hard bite.

Such things are needed I think, if you want to be a female Satanist. We don't have the opprtunities males do, to be honest. Yet, we are still just as cut off from society and the advantages that come from running with a herd.

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Original post: Leviathan

What opportunities do male satanists have that aren't afforded to the female?

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Original post: mateoflerajie

[QUOTE=Treasure Ra;276251]You simply cannot follow a satanic path unless you do deep hard work on your self. They WILL find evey hidden fear and doubt and use it against you - to make you stronger, more aware. [/QUOTE]

I was wondering who you mean by 'They' here? Just intrigued.

As to the point someone made that in satanism, it can feel as if you have no-one to fight your corner for you/with you, not saying they are right or wrong but that wouldn't be thought entirely true by some types of Theistic satanist/demonolators who believe satan is there to support/guide you too.

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Original post: m1thr0s

Hmm, I never quite put it into words, but I believe you just summed up my fascination with Satanism. I found myself always coming back to the satanism section of the forum, and I never could quite pinpoint why, but it always made me feel more purposeful and on path. It just seemed smarter.

that's probably because it is smarter...not so much because it produces smarter people necessarily as you have rightly observed, but because the path itself is cleared of excesses on all levels...nothing between you and your own godhead but the universe itself. hard to find a deal like that in tinytown...lol...

m1thr0s

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Original post: Moriah Conquering Wind

Do you seek acceptance? Are you secure with yourself? Are you strong enough to stand against the entirety of mankind?

Its funny, mainstream religions make me depressed

mainstream monotheism is the fastest downward spiral ever. word.

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Original post: 1911

You already know that denial isn't a river in Egypt, you accept your bi-polar makeup with the subtlety of a flying mallet (which makes me wonder but I will go with the flow) I'd say if you truly understand you have some type of short-circuit in the brain,
the last thing you should be doing is screwing around with anything that has to do with some type of religion, strong beliefs and so on, I don't give a damn what it is or what you think it is. The foundations that the house of your mind sits on should be as stable as you can build it, check for leaks periodically and build from there.
Just my take.

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Original post: LadyHydralisk

What opportunities do male satanists have that aren't afforded to the female?

Well to put it bluntly, the stuff guys can do would get me raped, murdered or exploited.

Maybe if I was fat, or ugly, I would have a better chance in the world.

This is a whole other topic though...start one if you want, I have a crapload of Livejournal stuff to record so I'll join in when I can.

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Original post: Tevnon

[QUOTE=1911;276962]You already know that denial isn't a river in Egypt, you accept your bi-polar makeup with the subtlety of a flying mallet (which makes me wonder but I will go with the flow) I'd say if you truly understand you have some type of short-circuit in the brain,
the last thing you should be doing is screwing around with anything that has to do with some type of religion, strong beliefs and so on, I don't give a damn what it is or what you think it is. The foundations that the house of your mind sits on should be as stable as you can build it, check for leaks periodically and build from there.
Just my take.[/QUOTE]


I understand your viewpoint, but it isn't what you think. For starters a lot of the teachings in the occult about the combination of magic/spirituality being bad, dangerous, or whatnot come out of misconceptions about the mentally ill which were held to be true back in the 1970's. When the modern occult was youngue phsycology was in a phase in which the mentally ill were believed falsley to be much more of a threat to themselves and others than was the case, and much of that thinking got written up into occult literature and passed on as valid viewpoints.
The truth of the matter is a great many mentally ill individuals have solid, stable, and flourishing spiritualities. The interaction betwean mental illness and spirituality is a complex one and varies greatly from individual to individual.
Here is what I know to be true in my case on that matter:
Right hand path magic and folk magic are neither affected by my mental illness, nor do they make my symptoms worse in any way.
Chaos magic only has one minor ill affect upon me. Use of Chaos magic in any form occasionally sparks spontanious and uncontrolled changes in belief. For example I may occasionally suddenly feal Islam or some other such religion is the one and only religion for a short while, but it passes and life goes on.
Satanism causes depression in me.
That is pretty much it.
I am not a threat to myself, nor is my magic. Suppose you are working in a chemistry lab and a combination of chemicals unexpectedly explodes. There are three things you can do. The first is never to perform the same the experiment ever again. This is what following your advise would amount to. The second is to foolishly do exactly the same thing without reguard to safety. This seems to be what you have presumed me to be doing.
The third is to carefully set up controlled explosions with proper safety guards in place in such a way as to determine the exact process of which chemicals are reacting how to get the big blow up. This is more what I'm doing.
If I'm already fealing depressed I don't do anything Satanic as it would make me worse and I don't need that. If I'm fealing doubtful in my beliefs and opinions I don't do anything Chaos magic related as it could push me into an uncontrolled shift in belief. I'm not irresponsible about my mental illnes or my spirituality. I study the interaction betwean them to better understand them, and in a way which minimizes risk. I also take responsibility if things go wrong.
If there is anything I should or have to do different to accomodate my mental problems it is to be somewhat more right hand path than I would elsewise be. Like I said Right Hand Path magic has proven to be perfectly safe for me. Some mentally ill individuals can safely practice anything and be fine with it, some have problems practicing any religion; I only have a few mental quirks and hangups with anything left hand path to worry about.
As it turns out, though, I still get a sence that there is something in Satanism for me. There is something for me to learn there which has to be mastered for me to move on. I've already gained a great degree of self confidence and assertivness which I honestly lacked before. So long as I am mindful of my mental illness and don't do anything stupid the risks are actually relatively low, and the payoff can be quite rewarding. Notions that anyone mentally ill should have nothing to do with magic come out of the same time period when any mentally ill individual was locked up in an institution even if they were elsewise living a productive life and not a threat to anyone. Phsycology has let go of those outdated notions, but in the occult those misconceptions are still, unfortunately, often still believed to be fact when they are not.

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Original post: LadyHydralisk

Geez, tell me about it. After talking to a few psychologists I'm starting to wonder who's more open-minded - occultists scared of their own shadow or the psychologists who find nothing wrong with a little heavy meditation at all. I'm in the middle of a divorce over all of this so, as you might imagine it's a huge issue for me.

I'll never agree psychology is anything but bullshit, but on the contrary I believe the occult can have some great effects on one's mental and physical constitution (which often work hand in hand)

Anyways thanks for the thoughts, Tevnon.

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Original post: Tevnon

Your welcome!

Anyway I think I have an answer to my original question now, and it isn't something you would expect. I took everyone's advice and faced the depression until I got an answer. Satanism causes a greatly heightened sence of responsibility. That in and of its self isn't the problem. It isn't that there are things I find depressing I have to take responsibility for. Back when I was having a lot of trouble with my dad a lot of things happened in which I was victimized. I faced a lot of physical and verbal abuse. He also wouldn't let me have my birth certificate or social security card in order to blackmail and control me. It isn't taking responvcibility for this which causes the problem either. The thing is when I consider it (consciously or unconsciously) there is a great degree of ambiguity. I'm responsible of what happened to some extent. My dad is responsible for his actions, thus my dad is responsible for what happened. Who is or isn't responsible...it's very ambiguous. There lies the problem. Every person with a mental illness will have ceartain things which will trigger symptoms. For me one of those triggers is ambiguity; vagueness. There is no logical reason it is so. My mind just happens to be wired such that vaguness in any form causes me problems. For example I have a great deal of trouble filling out paperwork such as job applications and such because there are many possible right answers (which answer I should give has the same fealing of vagueness). Anything LIKE that will make me feal very anxious and produce mood swings and elsewise destabilize me.
Identifying such triggers is a part of taking responsibility for my mentall illness and my recovery. Once I have all such triggers mapped out I'll know how to avoid them.
Anyway, exploring why Satanism causes depression has led me to discover how much of a trigger vagueness is for me. I think I have learned what I was ment to learn now from Satanism. Unfortunately there is no real way to practice the paradigm of Satanism without the intence responcibility resulting in vaguness over who is responcible for my dad's former abuse and all the depression and such that induces in me. For my own mental health I should probably avoid the religion in my practice, at least for the time being.
What I have learned has further implications as well which extend beyond Satanism. My uncontrolled shifts in belief I get (paradigm shifting gone bad) when practicing Chaos magic may be related. Chaos is a rather vague concept, and Chaos magic, being rather free form, has a sence of vaguness to it. The question for me now will be in how can I practice Chaos magic in a way wich isn't vague or ambiguous at any point, and will doing so stabalize uncontrolled unwillful paradigm shifting. If not I might have to abandon it all together and stick to more traditional magic. At any rate I'll eventually map out all my triggers, and then I'll know exactly what I need to avoid both in my magic and elsewhere to stay out of trouble.
Thanks everyone for the support.

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Original post: LadyHydralisk

::sigh::: I understand what you're saying, but you know what this makes me think of?

If we look at the universe around us as a person, it seems quite likely it would be diagnosed with a mental illness. I don't think that's right.

I enjoy the many odd ways our universe is, and I think humans are much too emotional about harmless behaviors.

It's going to come around and bite us in the ass one of these days...