okay so everything is ... real ??????

[cyberdemon]

another kinda rant moment (pinch of salt, go)

actually, i have a question

anyone here ever just get overwhelmed when comprehending that in some way or form our "existence" is real? like
yo
here we are
and
this is it.

out of all the things possible (or impossible)

this is it.
yoooooooooooooooooo.

freaks me out. send help.

[RockDemon]

Did you read Kybalion?

[cyberdemon]

Did you read Kybalion?

it's in my reading list of downloaded pdfs of things. why though? is existentialism-ish things addressed?

[RockDemon]

Yes. I read it recently and enjoyed greatly. It sort of answered to most of my philosophic questions, and was corresponding to the most of my philosophic thoughts. But you know how it goes, when you get answers you get twice as much questions as well.

[cyberdemon]

yeah well
i'll end up reading it sooner or later, still going through astrology/astronomy things at the moment
i mean
we can have explanations or not
but
whoa
look at thissss
look at thaaat
omg
it's
real

[Desecrated]

it's
real

Prove it.

[cyberdemon]

it's
real

Prove it.

*points at you*

there

[Desecrated]

it's
real

Prove it.

*points at you*

there

How do you know I'm not just a fiction of your imagination.

[cyberdemon]

How do you know I'm not just a fiction of your imagination.

because then everyone's imagining everyone so it's a matter of paradox

[Khazargo]

It is a very weird feeling, i

[cyberdemon]

okay try to imagine if all this... earth, the sky, the universe didn't exist.. then.. what? why does this exist and what if it were something else or nothing at all?

[RockDemon]

okay try to imagine if all this... earth, the sky, the universe didn't exist.. then.. what? why does this exist and what if it were something else or nothing at all?

A combination of my thoughts and those from Kybalion. The universe and all are mental creations. So in a way it is all illusionary. However you and I are just a part of those mental creations, so for us, everything is pretty much real.

[Desecrated]

okay try to imagine if all this... earth, the sky, the universe didn't exist.. then.. what? why does this exist and what if it were something else or nothing at all?

The world is the illusion our mind makes to make it easier to understand.

[Desecrated]

How do you know I'm not just a fiction of your imagination.

because then everyone's imagining everyone so it's a matter of paradox

Well, you know that you exist. But the rest of us are just part of you.-

[cyberdemon]

okay try to imagine if all this... earth, the sky, the universe didn't exist.. then.. what? why does this exist and what if it were something else or nothing at all?

The world is the illusion our mind makes to make it easier to understand.

i dont believe in nasa why are they still real
then again i dont believe in aliens and i haven't seen an alien yet

[Desecrated]

okay try to imagine if all this... earth, the sky, the universe didn't exist.. then.. what? why does this exist and what if it were something else or nothing at all?

The world is the illusion our mind makes to make it easier to understand.

i dont believe in nasa why are they still real
then again i dont believe in aliens and i haven't seen an alien yet

Because at some moment as a child you did wanted to travel to space, how ever fleeting that thought was, it is now a "reality"
OR, there not real, you only think so.

[Nahemah]

Nihil enim est omne quod licet...

Social constructionism or the social construction of reality (also social concept) is a theory of knowledge in sociology and communication theory that examines the development of jointly constructed understandings of the world that form the basis for shared assumptions about reality.

[CCoburn]

I have often asked "Why does anything exist at all?"It almost seems as though non-existence(nothing)should be the default value, but here we are. It appears to boil down to one of two things: There is an eternal catalyst, or something comes from nothing. I used to be a fan of the former, but now I wonder about the latter; the possibility of reason being transcended.

The Magickal formula "ARARITA":

One is my beginning(convergence to one from nothing). One is my individuality. My permutation is one.

EHEIEH I Am One. From nothing.

Cheers

[Haelos]

I don't think people around here read or practice as much as they say..

We can ponder these paradoxical questions for ages, as philosophers have already done. But ultinately, this will only lead you back to square one.

[cyberdemon]

we do. it's just that these questions have answers so profound that the answers are just overwhelming

i mean i started reading socrates/plato/aristotle philosophy to see what kind of conclusions they had and again they have the usual ascension idea. they went as far as to divide up a 3-fold support system for everything for their theory but..

the problem is: its all already here so if what if it wasn't then what would exist?

[Napoli]

I agree 100% with Rock Demon. 'The Kybalion' is one of the best books out there on this matter. You could also try reading 'The Zohar'. For once I will take a page out of Desecrated's book and ask you to go to the library and find out the answers on your own [grin] .

[Nahemah]

In English this time, lol:

"Nothing is true, everything is permitted..."

Your real may not be my real, you see....It's all went a bit post- modern these days.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Socia ... of_Reality

Symbolic universes:

Symbolic universes are created to provide legitimation to the created institutional structure. Symbolic universes are a set of beliefs “everybody knows” that aim at making the institutionalized structure plausible and acceptable for the individual—who might otherwise not understand or agree with the underlying logic of the institution. As an ideological system, the symbolic universe “puts everything in its right place”. It provides explanations for why we do things the way we do. Proverbs, moral maxims, wise sayings, mythology, religions and other theological thought, metaphysical traditions and other value systems are part of the symbolic universe. They are all (more or less sophisticated) ways to legitimize established institutions.

“The function of legitimation is to make objectively available and subjectively plausible the ‘first-order’ objections that have been institutionalized… Proverbs, moral maxims and wise sayings are common on this level… [as well as] explicit theories… symbolic processes… a general theory of the cosmos and a general theory of man… The symbolic universe also orders history. It locates all collective events in a cohesive unity that includes past, present and future.”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reality_tunnel

For Wilson (Robert Anton), a fully functioning human ought to be able to be aware of his or her reality tunnel, and able to keep it flexible enough to accommodate, and to some degree empathize with, different reality tunnels, different "game rules", different cultures.... Constructivist thinking is the exercise of metacognition to become aware of our reality tunnels or labyrinths and the elements that "program" them. Constructivist thinking should, ideally, decrease the chance that we will confuse our map of the world with the actual world.... [This philosophy] is currently expressed in many Eastern consciousness-exploration techniques.

Another example is Lacan's distinction between "The Real" and the "Symbolic". Lacan argued that the Real is the imminent unified reality which is mediated through symbols that allow it to be parsed into intelligible and differentiated segments. The symbolic, which is primarily subconscious, is further abstracted into the Imaginary (our actual beliefs and understandings of reality). These two orders ultimately shape the way we come to perceive reality.

See also:

Altered state of consciousness
Collective consciousness
Collective unconscious
Consensus reality
Consensus theory of truth
Cosmic consciousness
Ideasthesia
Paradigm
Perspectivism
Schema (psychology)
Social constructionism
The Social Construction of Reality
Self-concept
World view
Systems theory (anthropology)
Systems theory ( overarching)
Game theory

TL;DR?

Khaos provides.

[CCoburn]

We can ponder these paradoxical questions for ages, as philosophers have already done. But ultinately, this will only lead you back to square one.

Not so...
When you find yourself going around in circles, then you know you are making progress [crazy]

Then you realize that "reason" is not a bridge to all truth.
QM helps to confirm this, as at a Quantum level particles pop in and out of existence all the time. Something from nothing/nowhere. Absurd but true - truth transcending reason.

Some things will forever be speculated upon, since there is no way to prove them...yet. Of course certain truths that are beyond us could be given to us from beings further up in the hierarchy. As the Qabalists claim.

So I vote for something from nothing, and move on. There's lots to do.

I undoubtedly will have a recurring itch for this sort of thing though - sigh -

[cyberdemon]

tl;dr indeed because again, it's all explanations of what exists and why it exists the way it does

alright, for one, i'm totally not feeling this whole "everything is your imagination" construct. at all. never have. it's fun and all, thinking that what one person is doing is just rendering the universe for his/her own perception but that theory just doesn't even feel right to me.

well. this thread's going somewhere, at least. i'm just gonna say here that it's silly, really. existence of everything is to some extent already proven, given, accepted, and its "why" is theorized in some way.

i don't think i'm able to actually put my thoughts to words, for once.

[Napoli]

This world is not OUR perception but the Source's mental construction. Yes, like above, so below, our perceptions can influence the surroundings. Everything in this world is dual. Just like the Source is simultaneously the All and No-thing (Ain), so our universe is both real and an illusion. That's why it is called 'maya' because it FEELS real. We have to overcome it and realise the oneness of everything before uniting with the Source. The situation is akin to Earth rotating around the Sun but we can't feel it thanks to gravity.

As for why the universe came into existence I can give a reason from the Zohar. YHVH wanted to experience pleasure. So the Malkuth was created to experience goodness for the sake of God. That's what the esoteric Jews strive for. Normally, it is thought that the Source wanted 'to know' how it feels to exist. Hence, here we are.