Roman Revival(Cloning) Project?

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Liberator
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Roman Revival(Cloning) Project?

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Interesting. This organization wants to literally bring back the Roman ways starting from within western civilization I believe. Its mythology and spirituality, culture and cultural practices along with the entire political order. Also not racist though monocultural based, assimilating all people types non-discriminately regardless into one civilization while absorbing everything they had in their previous society as their own together. That was how the Romans did it though this group no longer believes in "conquest" anymore but firstly bringing it back through its heir cultures being the best bet. People like the far-right/racists would be suppressed swiftly + forcefully if they ever came to power due to the fact it threatens the peace of the stage along with its stability. They want a literal modern day clone of the ways of the Romans, not some altered re-enactment. Might be an interesting group to investigate as they could have knowledge on the Roman ancient magick practices. Because since they have so successfully reconstructed them to a point where people can feel them as they did thousands of years ago, you could say these guys are the legitimate successors of them?

P.S Would it be for better or worse if in today's world the Romans/their ways' came back? With how some say it would be best that we should have them back in today's world situation?

http://www.novaroma.org/nr/Main_Page

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Re: Roman Revival(Cloning) Project?

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I've heard quite a bit about Nova Roma but I have to admit that I haven't read extensively on the details.

As far as I can tell the re-emergence of Roman-style government was Pasquale Paoli and Corsica, about 20 years before the US authored the Declaration of Independence and later it's US Constitution.

If this sounds in any way ignorant may someone with more knowledge of these things correct me; I think what Nova Roma may be able to do is breath a heart and soul back into our system. The theology is getting cut, we're realizing that the three Abrahamic religions, as they're exoterically offered today, are not sufficient - especially as put to shame as they've been by all the things reductive materialists can validly say about them - to guide our ethos. If the republican form of government was the specialty of Greek and Roman culture, it may be wise for us to re-adapt the rest of the culture as well. If I remember correctly the Freemasonic ideas that our country was built on were built in an attempt to reorganize the Christian impulse to a higher cusp - ie. to the integrities and virtues that the high-pagan mysteries demanded and as time went on that tapered off.

Not sure if it's just an uncanny coincidence but I'm presently right in the middle of reading Manly P Hall's seventh lecture in Lectures on Ancient Philosophy, one where he's giving the philosophical moorings of salvation by grace a fairly good tongue-lashing and also saying a great deal to the credit of the various schools of thought such as the Orphic, other Greek mysteries, and Alexandrian gnosticism that it borrowed rather indiscriminately from.

If Nova Roma is hoping to breath life back into the western world by matching republican democracy with an exalted and modern day version of the theological platform it was originally founded on - they may very well be onto something. That and, if they're really able to rebuild things like the rites of Isis, Osiris, and the various mysteries that were robust and healthy at the time - in perhaps a far-flung fantasy of mine blow away what's come before them in terms of the Rosicrucian, Golden Dawn, and Thelemic systems - we'd be hugely in their debt.

Western culture, to survive, has to stand for something and I don't think consumerism will cut it - especially as machines replace people and thus wages and buying power. If they mean to generalize the options of philosophic living on to the broader populace, regardless of whether or not they want to keep the American Eagle, Old Navy, smartphones, and active Starbucks card - then I'd say they're perhaps on to something quite big. Without moral resuscitation we can't have political resuscitation because our politicians and their policies are too much a reflection of us to fall particularly far from the tree.
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Re: Roman Revival(Cloning) Project?

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Cybernetic_Jazz wrote:I've heard quite a bit about Nova Roma but I have to admit that I haven't read extensively on the details.

As far as I can tell the re-emergence of Roman-style government was Pasquale Paoli and Corsica, about 20 years before the US authored the Declaration of Independence and later it's US Constitution.

If this sounds in any way ignorant may someone with more knowledge of these things correct me; I think what Nova Roma may be able to do is breath a heart and soul back into our system. The theology is getting cut, we're realizing that the three Abrahamic religions, as they're exoterically offered today, are not sufficient - especially as put to shame as they've been by all the things reductive materialists can validly say about them - to guide our ethos. If the republican form of government was the specialty of Greek and Roman culture, it may be wise for us to re-adapt the rest of the culture as well. If I remember correctly the Freemasonic ideas that our country was built on were built in an attempt to reorganize the Christian impulse to a higher cusp - ie. to the integrities and virtues that the high-pagan mysteries demanded and as time went on that tapered off.

Not sure if it's just an uncanny coincidence but I'm presently right in the middle of reading Manly P Hall's seventh lecture in Lectures on Ancient Philosophy, one where he's giving the philosophical moorings of salvation by grace a fairly good tongue-lashing and also saying a great deal to the credit of the various schools of thought such as the Orphic, other Greek mysteries, and Alexandrian gnosticism that it borrowed rather indiscriminately from.

If Nova Roma is hoping to breath life back into the western world by matching republican democracy with an exalted and modern day version of the theological platform it was originally founded on - they may very well be onto something. That and, if they're really able to rebuild things like the rites of Isis, Osiris, and the various mysteries that were robust and healthy at the time - in perhaps a far-flung fantasy of mine blow away what's come before them in terms of the Rosicrucian, Golden Dawn, and Thelemic systems - we'd be hugely in their debt.

Western culture, to survive, has to stand for something and I don't think consumerism will cut it - especially as machines replace people and thus wages and buying power. If they mean to generalize the options of philosophic living on to the broader populace, regardless of whether or not they want to keep the American Eagle, Old Navy, smartphones, and active Starbucks card - then I'd say they're perhaps on to something quite big. Without moral resuscitation we can't have political resuscitation because our politicians and their policies are too much a reflection of us to fall particularly far from the tree.
Yeah, a return of the ways of the Romans does seem to suit today's society very well if it replaced consumerism when you think about it.

They are taking a spiritual, "education" and "virtue" approach but I believe they should create a paramilitary to protect themselves/be prepared to use force against those who cannot be reasoned with that stand in the way. Good luck to them, would be interesting to see a "Roman ideology" come into the political world of today as well to compete with the present ones. Would be interesting as if they did rise to power.

A much better alternative than things like I.S or the Oregon militiamen today for those who are looking for a purpose and alternative.

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Re: Roman Revival(Cloning) Project?

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I'm iffy on the paramilitary - ie. that's how a group gets counted as explosive hatters by quite reasonable people. Better if they just did tons of charitable work and events and got known for practicing what they want to give to broader society.
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Re: Roman Revival(Cloning) Project?

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Cybernetic_Jazz wrote:I'm iffy on the paramilitary - ie. that's how a group gets counted as explosive hatters by quite reasonable people. Better if they just did tons of charitable work and events and got known for practicing what they want to give to broader society.
Its not necessarily to go fight in wars right away but it would be best solely for defence of the group(their State). Some movements may face violence or persecution from especially race motivated far-fighters who certainly won't take kindly to what the old ways of the Romans stood for thus a defence-only military might be needed.

The movement is on my support list but I do not want to be strictly bound to Romans, as some aspects of the culture aren't for me due to my egalitarian beliefs such as their class acceptance approach which resembles Confucianism. They are a proto-state/nation which is also interesting.

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Re: Roman Revival(Cloning) Project?

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Liberator wrote:Its not necessarily to go fight in wars right away but it would be best solely for defence of the group(their State). Some movements may face violence or persecution from especially race motivated far-fighters who certainly won't take kindly to what the old ways of the Romans stood for thus a defence-only military might be needed.
Better way to do that - a solid team of lawyers. I'm sure they have some connections already, ie. as a group gains in size you'll have professions of all types available and I'm sure pro bono work would be one of those things a member or group of members could contribute. Similarly would thing that the ACLU would be on their side if they were facing any overt persecution.
Liberator wrote:The movement is on my support list but I do not want to be strictly bound to Romans, as some aspects of the culture aren't for me due to my egalitarian beliefs such as their class acceptance approach which resembles Confucianism. They are a proto-state/nation which is also interesting.
I saw that there was a 2011 movie that was based on them, albeit when I saw the previews it didn't look particularly flattering. If they were going to consider, say, slavery a solution to economic problems - it's not only regressive but it's a waste in our modern era unless one intends to treat people like machinery and pound on them like throw-away appliances. If that were the case I'd have to with draw support - ie. it would be a lacuna in their principles.
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Re: Roman Revival(Cloning) Project?

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Cybernetic_Jazz wrote:
Liberator wrote:Its not necessarily to go fight in wars right away but it would be best solely for defence of the group(their State). Some movements may face violence or persecution from especially race motivated far-fighters who certainly won't take kindly to what the old ways of the Romans stood for thus a defence-only military might be needed.
Better way to do that - a solid team of lawyers. I'm sure they have some connections already, ie. as a group gains in size you'll have professions of all types available and I'm sure pro bono work would be one of those things a member or group of members could contribute. Similarly would thing that the ACLU would be on their side if they were facing any overt persecution.
Liberator wrote:The movement is on my support list but I do not want to be strictly bound to Romans, as some aspects of the culture aren't for me due to my egalitarian beliefs such as their class acceptance approach which resembles Confucianism. They are a proto-state/nation which is also interesting.
I saw that there was a 2011 movie that was based on them, albeit when I saw the previews it didn't look particularly flattering. If they were going to consider, say, slavery a solution to economic problems - it's not only regressive but it's a waste in our modern era unless one intends to treat people like machinery and pound on them like throw-away appliances. If that were the case I'd have to with draw support - ie. it would be a lacuna in their principles.
From what I've read if you mean "Nova Roma" the film was not about a revival of the Romans or based on them but about an alternate history of if they had never collapsed and went on to conquer most of the world, invade countries for oil while continuing their technological advances uninterrupted with the same political order. Basically it is saying we would have gotten a "Yes we are imperialist/an empire, now deal with it." or a "Yes we are invading you, surrender to our interests and you will be rewarded." version of the U.S.A or British Empire.

If they were the cradle of civilization and were said to be sponsored by "the gods" wouldn't this technically mean that the Roman ideology is the ideology of the gods? For the Nova Roma organization's approach to slavery/economic issues idk. Maybe I will ask. Machinery and robotics would probably have replaced slaves if they did take over I believe.

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Re: Roman Revival(Cloning) Project?

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...By the 3rd century bc the plebeians gained equal voting rights with the patricians, so that all Roman citizens were enfranchised, but the value of the voting right was related to wealth because the Roman assemblies were organized by property qualifications. Civitas also included such rights as jus honorum (eligibility for public office) and jus militiae (right of military service)—though these rights were restricted by property qualifications...
http://www.britannica.com/topic/civitas

We already have this in the West, it's called Capitalism and it's corrrupt as heck, just like Rome was. All it took was adding Calvinistic rationality to pre existing Roman ideals.

I don't perceive these people to be natural heirs to anything and I'm pretty sure folks round here would fight them now, just as much and as hard as we successfully did in the way back when times. Pax Romana my arse, lol. Religion eventually triumphed where politics and war could not, though, sadly.

The laws in Scotland have much of their bases in our Celtic past mixed with Norse influences, as we did not get as embedded by Roman culture as countries further South and East did. This is also true of other countries in modern Europe, especially in the North. However, that varied a lot by social class and previous/ currently dominant discourses obscure these facts, just as much now as they did then. [twisted]

The 'ideal' Roman society never existed in Europe and resistance to Romanisation was much more widespread and long lasting than is generally acknowledged.

A bit of a read, if you're interested in more of this...

Dominant discourses in European History

https://goo.gl/t0fZ8i

At least this time round, when it comes to would be Empire building, we have a lot less state power tied up with religion and that is a big advantage...

It would be a giant step backwards to return to Romish ways.
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