Original post: lucifertruth
I noticed that there are a lot of modern satanists etc. here. Are there any traditional Luciferians? Here are our key points.
KEY LUCIFERIAN DOCTRINE
SATAN and LUCIFER are not the same. SATAN rebelled against GOD and created the material world. LUCIFER is the messenger of GOD who brings light to humanity. All religions who worship the creator of this world are in fact worshipping SATAN who is not the MOST HIGH GOD. This includes most Christians, Muslims and Jews.
SATAN rebelled because he developed PRIDE. PRIDE is the original sin and the MOTHER of all others. It is basically the fear of DEATH or CEASING TO EXIST and causes a desire for control and power. When SATAN created man in his image, man INHERITED PRIDE.
There was no SIN or EVIL before PRIDE. There was no FEAR before PRIDE.
LUCIFER brings man knowledge symbolised in the bible by two trees.
THE TREE OF THE KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL.
Once man has a knowledge of good and evil, he develops wisdom and is able to discern many things for himself. He is also more able to observe himself and others. SATAN forbids man to touch this tree because he doesnâ??t want us to realise that the creation is imperfect and thus stop worshipping itâ??s creator. The fruit of this tree also makes man wiser and better able to cope with the difficulties of material existence. It is for this reason that Luciferians are generally healthier and better off financially than most.
THE TREE OF LIFE
The tree of life is the information on how man may develop his spirit and KNOW GOD DIRECTLY. This is often called GNOSIS, a GREEK word. SATAN the creator of the material world does not want you to discover GNOSIS because he wants to be worshipped as the supreme God.
GOD sent LUCIFER as his messenger to free man and to instruct man on the TREES OF KNOWLEDGE and the TREE OF LIFE. GOD also performed the supreme sacrifice and descended into matter so that man may have access to his unconditional LOVE. This is the SON OF GOD who actually IS GOD suffering in matter.
The number of MATERIAL EXISTENCE is 4. This is because you need four points before you have a three dimensional _object_. The cross represents 4 the number of material existence. CHRIST ON THE CROSS REPRESENTS GOD SUFFERING IN MATTER SO THAT MAN MAY KNOW LOVE AND BE SET FREE FROM SATANâ??S SCHEME TO HAVE HIMSELF WORSHIPPED.
SATANIC religions point to the fact that the MATERIAL CREATOR condemned women to be subordinate to men as a punishment for her role in eating the fruit of the TREE OF KNOWLEDGE. LUCIFERIANS do not accept this and see men and women as EQUAL. Genesis chapter 3 : 16: Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.
Regards,
John B
http://www.lucifer-truth.org
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Original post: doh
Actually, this is very interesting and holds to what a few Luciferians I know believe. Not all of them, mind you, by any means. But a few. For lack of better terminology, you've hit on the "spirituality" that some Luciferians hold true. "The Bringer of Light" aspects.
Actually, this is very interesting and holds to what a few Luciferians I know believe. Not all of them, mind you, by any means. But a few. For lack of better terminology, you've hit on the "spirituality" that some Luciferians hold true. "The Bringer of Light" aspects.
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Original post: Leviathan
I believe you would find Thelema, and most particularly, "The Book of The Law"...up your Luciferian alley.
I believe you would find Thelema, and most particularly, "The Book of The Law"...up your Luciferian alley.
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Original post: frater luciferi
i completely am in agreement! let lucifer be the next messiah..maybe help us all kill god.. and get my revenge :evil:
i completely am in agreement! let lucifer be the next messiah..maybe help us all kill god.. and get my revenge :evil:
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Original post: frater luciferi
aliester crowelys high gaurdian angel was/is aiwas which was actually lucifer...my head almost exploded from the paradigm shift i experienced learning that.Leviathan;304764 wrote:I believe you would find Thelema, and most particularly, "The Book of The Law"...up your Luciferian alley.
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Original post: Kath_
[QUOTE=frater luciferi;304991]aliester crowelys high gaurdian angel was/is aiwas which was actually lucifer...my head almost exploded from the paradigm shift i experienced learning that.[/QUOTE]
fo shizzle?
I thought it was kinda intuitive.
[QUOTE=frater luciferi;304991]aliester crowelys high gaurdian angel was/is aiwas which was actually lucifer...my head almost exploded from the paradigm shift i experienced learning that.[/QUOTE]
fo shizzle?
I thought it was kinda intuitive.
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Original post: lucifertruth
Thanks for your comments, some interesting points.
Kind Regards,
John Ball
http://www.lucifer-truth.org
Thanks for your comments, some interesting points.
Kind Regards,
John Ball
http://www.lucifer-truth.org
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Original post: frater luciferi
maybe it was the concrete evidence vs. the "knowing". its one thing to have a gut instinct telling you something and another having the proof in all its gleefull glory. crowely the proto-neo gnostic in all his spiritual revelery consulted the high angel of gnosis/light to develop a religion ment to topple the false god.Kath_;305069 wrote:fo shizzle?
I thought it was kinda intuitive.
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Original post: 1911
It's most everything to me.
It's most everything to me.
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Original post: Cyrix_777
For a very good analysis of the Lucifer question check this out
http://jonbuckley.blogspot.com/2007/10/ ... stion.html
Two excellent books on Luciferian Gnosis that I have just finished are
The Pillars Of Tubal Cain - Nigel Jackson / Michael Howard
The Book Of Fallen Angels - Michael Howard
For a very good analysis of the Lucifer question check this out
http://jonbuckley.blogspot.com/2007/10/ ... stion.html
Two excellent books on Luciferian Gnosis that I have just finished are
The Pillars Of Tubal Cain - Nigel Jackson / Michael Howard
The Book Of Fallen Angels - Michael Howard
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Original post: frater luciferi
i really liked that...i will reiterate a very overused phrase that i keep on regurgitating..what does lucifer have or ever had to do with christianity? no offense intended.Cyrix_777;305374 wrote:For a very good analysis of the Lucifer question check this out
http://jonbuckley.blogspot.com/2007/10/ ... stion.html
Two excellent books on Luciferian Gnosis that I have just finished are
The Pillars Of Tubal Cain - Nigel Jackson / Michael Howard
The Book Of Fallen Angels - Michael Howard
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Original post: Cyrix_777
Frater I think you make a very valid point as to the history of Lucifer predates xtianity but we can safely assume or compare Lucifer to Venus and the Christ/Lucifer connection"the morning star" its all metaphoric in my opinion and the Michael Howard and Nigel Jackson books go on about this hidden Gnosis and how it has been suppressed and hidden through the ages through myth and legend they make some Interesting connections and reveal that Lucifer is Actually the Angelic Being Lumiel
Frater I think you make a very valid point as to the history of Lucifer predates xtianity but we can safely assume or compare Lucifer to Venus and the Christ/Lucifer connection"the morning star" its all metaphoric in my opinion and the Michael Howard and Nigel Jackson books go on about this hidden Gnosis and how it has been suppressed and hidden through the ages through myth and legend they make some Interesting connections and reveal that Lucifer is Actually the Angelic Being Lumiel
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Original post: lucifertruth
Thanks for those comments.
Thanks for those comments.
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Original post: Cyrix_777
Just an update the article that I mentioned has moved here. I will add to this thread when I get a chance I have a lot more to share
V
Just an update the article that I mentioned has moved here. I will add to this thread when I get a chance I have a lot more to share
V
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Original post: Bone_Dancer
Interesting.
Question. If the one true god, not that which is actually worshiped as god but is Satan, per your information, is god for all that that word implies, how could Satan, a spirit, create the world, a domain for his masquerade and the illusion beneath which is pain, suffering and death, without the one true god's license to do so!?
And if Satan created the material world and this was his prison abode for daring to rebel against the one true god, how is it man was created by the one true god to dwell within the prison that is Satan's domain and thus find his way to the truth and the life, (the two tree's) that could not have been planted there bearing those fruits, unless Satan/Yahweh creator of the the material realm, put them there!? And then Lucifer, the bringer of knowledge per your remarks, entered into the garden and enlightened the woman of the fruits so she and her mate could attain Gnosis and free themselves of the illusion that Yahweh/Satan manifest as that material plane.
And would not pride, (A high or inordinate opinion of one's own dignity, importance, merit, or superiority, whether as cherished in the mind or as displayed in bearing, conduct, etc....) if it is the only true sin, have been possessed by both Yahweh/Satan and by the one true god as well?! Else there would be no differentiation about which god is true, nor would there have been a reprisal set against Yahweh/Satan for daring to think itself equal or even superior to the one true god, if Satan had the power even after banishment from heaven to access his angelic god given powers.
Just a few thoughts relative to your statements about traditional Luciferianism.
I look forward to your thoughts.
lucifertruth;304749 wrote:I noticed that there are a lot of modern satanists etc. here. Are there any traditional Luciferians? Here are our key points.
KEY LUCIFERIAN DOCTRINE......Regards,
John B
http://www.lucifer-truth.org
Interesting.
Question. If the one true god, not that which is actually worshiped as god but is Satan, per your information, is god for all that that word implies, how could Satan, a spirit, create the world, a domain for his masquerade and the illusion beneath which is pain, suffering and death, without the one true god's license to do so!?
And if Satan created the material world and this was his prison abode for daring to rebel against the one true god, how is it man was created by the one true god to dwell within the prison that is Satan's domain and thus find his way to the truth and the life, (the two tree's) that could not have been planted there bearing those fruits, unless Satan/Yahweh creator of the the material realm, put them there!? And then Lucifer, the bringer of knowledge per your remarks, entered into the garden and enlightened the woman of the fruits so she and her mate could attain Gnosis and free themselves of the illusion that Yahweh/Satan manifest as that material plane.
And would not pride, (A high or inordinate opinion of one's own dignity, importance, merit, or superiority, whether as cherished in the mind or as displayed in bearing, conduct, etc....) if it is the only true sin, have been possessed by both Yahweh/Satan and by the one true god as well?! Else there would be no differentiation about which god is true, nor would there have been a reprisal set against Yahweh/Satan for daring to think itself equal or even superior to the one true god, if Satan had the power even after banishment from heaven to access his angelic god given powers.
Just a few thoughts relative to your statements about traditional Luciferianism.
I look forward to your thoughts.
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Original post: Bone_Dancer
Well, I can guess we'll not be getting any more input from the good Reverend. Lucifer Truth has closed down. It's interesting to note this occured just shortly after some members there asked what appeared to be hard questions of the Reverend. Questions Christian Bible answers didn't seem to satisfy for anyone that called themselves a Luciferian before arriving at that site that proposed to the reader public they knew the truth about Lucifer. I guess the truth is they don't realize Lucifer was the first skeptic! And as such it would appear questions, hard questions, weren't part of the program.
I remember when there was a hot debate about the lifetime membership fee of $200. charged by Church of Satan.
Lucifer Truth offered training in the Luciferian Doctrine, once one accepted the tenets of Luciferianism as proffered by Lucifer Truth, for 500.00 U.S. However, that has increased in the short time I've been aware of this organization, to $1000!
I imagine both Peter Gilmore, and Anton if he were able, would laugh quite heartily at that one.
Just before they filled out that deposit slip and drove their Bentley to the drive-thru.
This is an e-mail from 'Lucifer Truth'
Message: A decision has been made to close the website Lucifer Truth until further notice. There will be no more public teaching from the Rev. Sheraton due to dissatisfaction within the Luciferian community. The debate on secrecy is on going and Rev Sheraton has decided to close the site until a general consensus is reached.Personal tuition is available from Reverend William Sheraton. Inscription fee is now 1000 USD. to cover time and expenses. All applications to study with the Reverend must be received by the 24 th December 2007. This e-mail will cease to function after the 29th December.
Regards,John
Well, I can guess we'll not be getting any more input from the good Reverend. Lucifer Truth has closed down. It's interesting to note this occured just shortly after some members there asked what appeared to be hard questions of the Reverend. Questions Christian Bible answers didn't seem to satisfy for anyone that called themselves a Luciferian before arriving at that site that proposed to the reader public they knew the truth about Lucifer. I guess the truth is they don't realize Lucifer was the first skeptic! And as such it would appear questions, hard questions, weren't part of the program.
I remember when there was a hot debate about the lifetime membership fee of $200. charged by Church of Satan.
Lucifer Truth offered training in the Luciferian Doctrine, once one accepted the tenets of Luciferianism as proffered by Lucifer Truth, for 500.00 U.S. However, that has increased in the short time I've been aware of this organization, to $1000!
I imagine both Peter Gilmore, and Anton if he were able, would laugh quite heartily at that one.
Just before they filled out that deposit slip and drove their Bentley to the drive-thru. This is an e-mail from 'Lucifer Truth'
Message: A decision has been made to close the website Lucifer Truth until further notice. There will be no more public teaching from the Rev. Sheraton due to dissatisfaction within the Luciferian community. The debate on secrecy is on going and Rev Sheraton has decided to close the site until a general consensus is reached.Personal tuition is available from Reverend William Sheraton. Inscription fee is now 1000 USD. to cover time and expenses. All applications to study with the Reverend must be received by the 24 th December 2007. This e-mail will cease to function after the 29th December.
Regards,John
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Original post: Cyrix_777
Strange considering this knowledge is hidden in plain site if you dig deep enough?
Strange considering this knowledge is hidden in plain site if you dig deep enough?
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Original post: Bone_Dancer
I would agree. I think the premise for groups such as LT is they've made the observation that most people don't care to dig for themselves, they'd rather be led to find their way to what's already compiled and receive instruction from the top (Lucifer 101) down. (Graduation)
I appreciate a thread like this actually. It lends it's own example that truth can be arbitrary and quite costly to find that out.
I would agree. I think the premise for groups such as LT is they've made the observation that most people don't care to dig for themselves, they'd rather be led to find their way to what's already compiled and receive instruction from the top (Lucifer 101) down. (Graduation)
I appreciate a thread like this actually. It lends it's own example that truth can be arbitrary and quite costly to find that out.
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Original post: Motherbrainzebes
you know what? Scratch last comment, just did some research.
you know what? Scratch last comment, just did some research.
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Original post: lucifertruth
seek and ye shall find
seek and ye shall find
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Original post: Great American Desert
Lucifer Truth is a scam and a mockery. I noticed that Rev. William was banned from this forum some time ago (under the name WilliamSheraton[sp?) for being a completely obstinate jackass. I don't buy for one second that the request for money was a red herring. People starting up internet orders typically do so for the wrong reasons: reputation, profit and power. They can manipulate newcomers to the path, and newcomers are a profitable venture.
I have to say that proselytizing for Lucifer is incredibly backward. His message must be sought, not spread. Simply sharing your ideas in print is one thing, but declaring that you want to bring His message to the world cheapens the path and is an insult to those of us who have arrived here on our own efforts.
Lucifer Truth is a scam and a mockery. I noticed that Rev. William was banned from this forum some time ago (under the name WilliamSheraton[sp?) for being a completely obstinate jackass. I don't buy for one second that the request for money was a red herring. People starting up internet orders typically do so for the wrong reasons: reputation, profit and power. They can manipulate newcomers to the path, and newcomers are a profitable venture.
I have to say that proselytizing for Lucifer is incredibly backward. His message must be sought, not spread. Simply sharing your ideas in print is one thing, but declaring that you want to bring His message to the world cheapens the path and is an insult to those of us who have arrived here on our own efforts.
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Original post: lucifertruth
Zeena Laveys sex life
Zeena Laveys sex life
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Original post: Great American Desert
For the sake of context, I'll post the initial email I sent, since you've sought to publicize it all.
Greetings,
I registered for the site in the hopes of a discussion forum, but since I can't seem to find one, I'll do this via email.
In further reviewing your propaganda, I have found that you have much more of a proselytizing approach than I had initially picked up on. I have to differ with you here, as Lucifer is not a god for the masses. To assume that he could be fit for public consumption cheapens him. He is Lord of the Elite, so to speak, and cannot be the comfort of the lowest common denominator. The destination of all men is ultimately the same...we fuse with the All in the end. The message of Lucifer is for personal betterment, not ultimate salvation. This striving for personal betterment cannot be forced; the individual must seek it out. The individual must find Lucifer on his own, and when he does, he understands what this salvation is and what it means. Lucifer is like a mountain: majestic, beautiful and worth the effort to find, but you cannot bring the mountain to the masses. It must be left to the fortunate few to find Him and gaze upon His beauty.
There are points among your writings that I can relate to, but most I disagree with. But that's a matter of personal belief, so it's neither here nor there. But the spectacle that was shown recently with closing down Lucifer Truth because the great Rev. William was disappointed with the Luciferian community was laughable. You cannot open a forum for open-minded, freethinking individuals and expect everybody to swallow your propaganda. You should expect opposition. That's just something you will have to get used to.
Additionally, and this being my prime gripe, what great Wisdom you must hold to have the audacity to declare that it's worth $1000 just to share it! That very fact proves that your whole scheme is a complete farce. You're just another charlatan with dollar signs blocking your vision. You clearly have no Gnosis; you can just bullshit your way through an essay because profit and power might be waiting after the final period is typed.
You're welcome to retort, but there is no justification for attempting to gain wealth off of those with Gnostic lust, so it would be a wasted effort on your part.
This wasn't aimed to be an attack, really. I just thought somebody should point out what a mockery you are making of our Lord.
-J. Christner
--------------
Aside: The basis of Luciferianism is not tolerance and unconditional love. I doubt there are many who would agree with you on that point. The basis of Luciferianism is the unending quest for Wisdom and Truth and the evolution of the Self. Charity and goodwill may or may not follow, but they're certainly not the basis.
Many people take a black approach to Luciferianism. You take a very white approach; but the reality is indeed very grey.
For the sake of context, I'll post the initial email I sent, since you've sought to publicize it all.
Greetings,
I registered for the site in the hopes of a discussion forum, but since I can't seem to find one, I'll do this via email.
In further reviewing your propaganda, I have found that you have much more of a proselytizing approach than I had initially picked up on. I have to differ with you here, as Lucifer is not a god for the masses. To assume that he could be fit for public consumption cheapens him. He is Lord of the Elite, so to speak, and cannot be the comfort of the lowest common denominator. The destination of all men is ultimately the same...we fuse with the All in the end. The message of Lucifer is for personal betterment, not ultimate salvation. This striving for personal betterment cannot be forced; the individual must seek it out. The individual must find Lucifer on his own, and when he does, he understands what this salvation is and what it means. Lucifer is like a mountain: majestic, beautiful and worth the effort to find, but you cannot bring the mountain to the masses. It must be left to the fortunate few to find Him and gaze upon His beauty.
There are points among your writings that I can relate to, but most I disagree with. But that's a matter of personal belief, so it's neither here nor there. But the spectacle that was shown recently with closing down Lucifer Truth because the great Rev. William was disappointed with the Luciferian community was laughable. You cannot open a forum for open-minded, freethinking individuals and expect everybody to swallow your propaganda. You should expect opposition. That's just something you will have to get used to.
Additionally, and this being my prime gripe, what great Wisdom you must hold to have the audacity to declare that it's worth $1000 just to share it! That very fact proves that your whole scheme is a complete farce. You're just another charlatan with dollar signs blocking your vision. You clearly have no Gnosis; you can just bullshit your way through an essay because profit and power might be waiting after the final period is typed.
You're welcome to retort, but there is no justification for attempting to gain wealth off of those with Gnostic lust, so it would be a wasted effort on your part.
This wasn't aimed to be an attack, really. I just thought somebody should point out what a mockery you are making of our Lord.
-J. Christner
--------------
Aside: The basis of Luciferianism is not tolerance and unconditional love. I doubt there are many who would agree with you on that point. The basis of Luciferianism is the unending quest for Wisdom and Truth and the evolution of the Self. Charity and goodwill may or may not follow, but they're certainly not the basis.
Many people take a black approach to Luciferianism. You take a very white approach; but the reality is indeed very grey.
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Original post: lucifertruth
there s a demon in my soup
there s a demon in my soup
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Original post: EtuMalku
This is getting good!
This is getting good!