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Here you will find a simple, but very effective dream recall practice. It is important to practice it on regular basis, each day or as many times as possible. This technique will work as a self-hypnosis through meditation method, don’t worry it is really simple. And do note that if you will develop your meditation skills it will greatly increase the rate you can get into meditative state, focus and many other good things.

Preparations

For starters be sure to have a tidy work space, get into comfortable position (bed is my equipment of choice) were you will feel comfortable over the experience. You will have to get following items:
- Dream Diary/Book of Shadows
- Working pen
- Good mood
- 0.5l glass of water – drinking before sleep will increase your chance to wake up in the middle of the night and in that state it will be easier to remember the dream.

If there are some possible distractions, consider obtaining:
- Ear plugs
- Sleep mask to cover the light

Getting into the state

Drink the water that you have prepared. Lie down in your work spot, relax for 2-3 minutes, think, what you have done all this day, experience it again if you wish. Then if you feel calm, lift your arms above your head and tense all your body from toes to face muscles and then relax. Now you can change your position so you would be:
- On your back
- Legs straight and down
- Hands beside your hips
- Your body is straight
- You can use a small pillow, but remember to keep your body straight (not like a plank, but you get the point)

Now start noticing your breathing, take deep and slow breath in through your nose, hold it for 2 seconds and slowly exhale it out through your mouth. Imagine all the tension and worries going away each time you exhale. After 30s-1min continue to normal breathing and notice how you start taking in less oxygen and time between inhales has increased. Now put your focus to your toes and relax them as much as you can and move up your body calmly and slowly relaxing every cell in the body. Most people make mistake by not relaxing their jaw or muscles just around the eyes or they still keep moving the eyes (best gaze at one point just below the place where your eyebrows meet), it is very important to be completely relaxed, focus straight on the objective and that is relaxation at the moment.

When you have totally relaxed your body, stay calm for 2-5 minutes, try to be totally passive, don’t move even if you need a scratch, the body is checking if you are asleep. Then start giving strong, but calm truths (say it in your head, but you have to believe in it), “I am completely relaxed” wait few seconds and say “Every cell in my body is completely calm and relaxed”. And each time you say it you can feel how your body is going numb if it is not already. The say to yourself “I am going deeper, deeper, deeper.” And with every word “deeper” you feel that you start sink, deeper and deeper into the state. Now you are in the right state of mind, were your mind can be programmed to have good dream recall. Start saying these truths in your mind “I remember my dreams”, “I remember all my dreams”. Words can’t be just words, they have to have meaning, feeling to it, show the universe that you want it, but try to stay calm. Continue it for 2-5 minutes, then relax, you can drift into sleep from there or just gently change sleeping position and travel to the land of dreams.

When you wake up, memorize everything you can and quickly write everything into your dream diary or book of shadows, study it after wards, some dream might show your problems some might show something else. Go back to sleep or start the day. It is down to experience to develop what it means and opens up for you.

This is first time I am participating in a community, constructive criticism please.

Since you asked for constructive criticism, I will give some feedback.

ON THE WRITING STYLE
Each of your three “How to” posts in this section of the forum show a clear writing style. Your directions are broken down well and you have a nice progression of steps and concepts. What I don’t know, however, is the writing situation. Who are these directions for? Where (other than here) will they appear? Who is the audience?

The audience will determine how everything else gets phrased and the structure. By the style of writing and the basic level of the skills you are talking about, this would seem to fit in a “yahoo answers” or “wiki how” for the general public. In which case I would say, it’s fine, and in line with the common ideas. It repeats material often discussed in New Age materials.

If the audience, however, were an experienced occultist, such as many of those on OF, then there would be a number of issues with both the instructions and the assumptions behind such.

ON THE MAGICAL SIDE
In short, will it work? Yeah, probably. But not for the reasons you are thinking…

You have asked for feedback. There are many around here who could do so. But we would need to know who you are “talking” to, so to speak.

Cheers, I will check out posting post. I did not want to cramp all 3 past posts in one message so I posted them here. I did not know any books about the topic so I wrote how I did it, how it did work for me. And I do believe that it can work for anyone else, due to self hypnosis. [grin] But this is the topic that I am willing to explore as much as I can, but given the amount of information that I am receiving, it is really hard to keep up. But yea it was directed for the beginner who wants to get into lucid dreaming. And if a person can not remember them, this easy practice could surely assist. Thanks for your post! [thumbup]

But I have to disagree on

But not for the reasons you are thinking…

, self suggestion will do what it will say. For e.g. When I meditate sometimes my eyelids keep going up so I do same thing, I suggest myself that my eyelids are heavy and they wont go up until my meditation is finished. If I will take as truth, immediately I will not need to try keep my eyes closed and I will actually feel the heaviness increasing. Same goes for dream recall, its same as eyelids, its who we are.

I did not know any books about the topic so I wrote how I did it, how it did work for me.

https://www.google.com/#q=lucid+dreaming+books&tbm=shop

But I have to disagree on

But not for the reasons you are thinking…

, self suggestion will do what it will say.

Okay, fine, but you didn’t SAY that outright in your posts. You focused on counting breaths and how clean your space was. The best teaching tools follow the KISS formula. Keep It Simple, Stupid .


The directions for self-suggestion are simple: In those moments when you are all relaxed before sleep, program a suggestion to your subconscious. Boom. Simple.


Where did all this half a glass of water and make sure you are in a good mood stuff come from? Where is the basis for these aspects of the "directions"? Personally I smoke, drink Mountain Dew like a fish, and love pepperoni pizza. Why do you have to be in a good mood? Dreamwalking to find “naughty” spirits when you are a bit pissed off is a great stress reliever.

Suggestion, yes, programming your brain, yes. But all the gobble-dey gook you have on eating right and water and having to remember things the moment you get up, none of THAT is about the self-suggestion.

Given the amount of information that I am receiving, it is really hard to keep up.

I have no doubt on the amount you are receiving quickly. What you need to do is not get lost in the details of your understanding. Get to the core of things. Connect the dots. Lucid dreaming is only a step in a path of a whole different series of “magical” skills. It is a way to program the subconscious to manifest results in the dream space, and then from there outward. But in mucking up the works with a bunch of miscellaneous directives (without the clear acknowledgement up from of the idea of self suggestion… pft), you may miss out on where the skills lead.
The concept is simple:
In those moments when you are all relaxed before sleep, program a suggestion to your subconscious.

This means that once you begin to remember your dreams (which you can do through suggestion) then you can begin to self-program your dreams
http://www.occultforum.org/forum/viewto ... 13&t=35446
And with practice lucid dream, dream walk, communicate with spirits, work on astral, increase creativity and intelligence, increase productivity, etc. The "power" is not in the ritual, it is in the suggestion, how the will is focused. Because while in the dream state the “conscious mind” is quieted (and thus so is doubt), learning to lucid dream to perform magical operations can have rather "interesting" results in terms of manifestation.

In short what I’m trying to say is that there is more coming, don’t over complicate the first steps.

I totally agree with you, but need to not to forget to whom this post was going to. It was a tip that i use. [thumbup]

You focused on counting breaths and how clean your space was.

Breathing helps to relax and bring the tension away so it can change your hearth rate.(That is a good boost getting into the state which brings self suggestion state easier). As for clean and tidy space it is important to note that your surroundings do affect you. Even the shape of the room affects the energetics around the work place. And it will help you be at peace, in a good mood and of course it will increase your energetic level. Also being in a good mood, I mean by not having bad emotions will help to have unneeded distractions removed. (as dreams can easily bring last days mood, what you where thinking and so on, that is how nightmares come, right?:D).

The directions for self-suggestion are simple: In those moments when you are all relaxed before sleep, program a suggestion to your subconscious. Boom. Simple.

It's just that your formula does not give the small details that I intended to give. Small details like keeping muscles around your eyes relaxed. They might not seem important into getting relaxed state for an experienced occultist, but trust me a starter would appreciate it as I did when I got tipped in the beginning.

Where did all this half a glass of water and make sure you are in a good mood stuff come from? Where is the basis for these aspects of the "directions"? Personally I smoke, drink Mountain Dew like a fish, and love pepperoni pizza. Why do you have to be in a good mood? Dreamwalking to find “naughty” spirits when you are a bit pissed off is a great stress reliever.

We covered the good mood. Glass of water makes you wake up for a piss, new people in this business can not wake them self up any time they want, if they do, I applause. I do realize that bad foods give lower energetics. And I know it is better to have good energy capacities instead of eating unhealthy food that will reduce your body capabilities. I wont even go into that more. But for example cannabis (alcohol, no comment) that is only drug I use, it can be ignored at more experienced levels, but it actually does reduce your REM. And you do know what that means. I do understand the point your making, and it is right, but it depends on who is receiving the information.

Suggestion, yes, programming your brain, yes. But all the gobble-dey gook you have on eating right and water and having to remember things the moment you get up, none of THAT is about the self-suggestion.

I never said that everything in this post going to be about self-suggestion.

I have no doubt on the amount you are receiving quickly. What you need to do is not get lost in the details of your understanding. Get to the core of things. Connect the dots. Lucid dreaming is only a step in a path of a whole different series of “magical” skills. It is a way to program the subconscious to manifest results in the dream space, and then from there outward. But in mucking up the works with a bunch of miscellaneous directives (without the clear acknowledgement up from of the idea of self suggestion… pft), you may miss out on where the skills lead.

Aye, trying my best! [crazy] Totally agree only that its a step in a path and truly important one for a beginner, especially if he is interested in shamanism. I said my opinion about mucking. You cant miss out with good preparations. As by going through these directions and meditating not going a sleep I learnt to go into a dream while awake. Yes I am not leading someone in the direction that I know that might fail.

Thanks a lot for your constructive critisism, I will put into consideration all the points you pointed me out and I have already got something out of it, cheers. [thumbup]

Also, everyone has their own opinions on what is most important in their practices, I am just giving opportunity to see and maybe adapt some of the elements that I have used.

I totally agree with you, but need to not to forget to whom this post was going to.

A very excellent point. I do not know my audience. Thank you for the correction

One of the reasons why your posts interested me is because I've been outlining materials myself on some of the things possible once the basic skills of lucid dreaming and self-programming dreams are practiced. One of the issues I've been having is that my version of "instructions" consists of statements like

In those moments when you are all relaxed before sleep, program a suggestion to your subconscious. Boom. Simple.

Yeah.... You are absolutely right. That is not going to help Any good teacher knows how to lead the student from where they are to where they need to be. And I am not being a good teacher in this. I have a great deal to learn about how things are practiced currently and would appreciate your assistance, if you are willing. I would like to hear more about your experiences and how these skills have assisted you in life.

Totally agree only that its a step in a path and truly important one for a beginner, especially if he is interested in shamanism.

Agreed to the interest in Shamanism (and where I picked up some techniques). I happen to use the skills in other ways (like "dream writing" papers in college ). Overall a very interesting a complex topic

As by going through these directions and meditating not going a sleep I learnt to go into a dream while awake.

Very nice progress! Congratulations

Good to know that not only me getting something out of this. These are only small things, but id say that title is misleading and i can not change it. It is not 101, i was still in different state (half sleeping) when i wrote it.

I have a great deal to learn about how things are practiced currently

I started getting into magick seriously only 1-2 years ago. But I had interest in it since I was a child, considering the fact of all those stories my grandmother and my black witch neighbor where talking about. It scared me for a bit, but it still had that charm. And then teenage years came, high school. Party party, girls, friends, fight and so. The the destruction of my powers started ( note that when I was a kid, I could manage to go out of the body without much of hard work). The destruction of my mind, body and soul finished when i hit 18s-19s. From then dropped alcohol and poisons like that. Started getting into more mind work, sports and magick, wicca was my starting point from there. Due to the fact that only scientists I knew where wiccan. So basically I do not know about how things are practiced, but I can give a tip time to time from my own experience. But if your looking for right terminologies and so on, I am not your person.

But I do know that monroe institute if im correct has pretty decent material on this topic, please correct me if I am wrong. ( I did borrowed few ideas in dream exercise from them, due to educational purposes ;DD)

Thanks again for your, help. For a minute there i though that noones gonna critic it.

I started getting into magick seriously only 1-2 years ago….. But if your looking for right terminologies and so on, I am not your person.

Again, considering the short time that you have been focusing in practice, congratulations on your progress (it took me years to get to the dreaming while awake bit I've been working with dream work for about 16 years now). I don’t know if there are “correct” terminologies to this field at this point. It is, I think, an underdeveloped field which has a great deal of potential. But as both of our research may be showing, there is little out there on what it can be used for.

But I do know that monroe institute if im correct has pretty decent material on this topic, please correct me if I am wrong. ( I did borrowed few ideas in dream exercise from them, due to educational purposes ;DD)

I looked up the cite and can see where that “New Age” writing style came from. As far as their research goes, it depends on what you are looking for, I suppose. I have a tendency to value “peer reviewed” and “scholarly”, which means that I came at this topic overall through psychology and anthropology. So to me the sources you use are… eh

But perhaps there is something in the limits to both of our research into this, however. In other words, there is not much out there on what all these skills can do.

Let me give just one example of an entry level skill. Keep in mind that the brain actually remembers everything, every detail with all the senses, that you experience or think. “Forgetting” something is not a matter of the information disappearing but of the “bridge” or “hook” that would recall that memory to the conscious thought not connecting.

At the point of waking dream, for instance, your subconscious is in a highly suggestible state. If you can “consciously” program your “dream” of the subconscious, to visualize “connections” forming (thus bringing in Imagination), while suggesting to yourself that you are easing access to your complete memory (thus bringing in Will), then it is possible to increase your recall of information from the “inside out” so to speak (particularly, we’ve found, if the subconscious is also “rewarded” consciously). In other words, with simple suggestion in this state it is possible to increase your conscious productivity, intelligence, creativity, memory, “energetic” levels (including being able to “rest” without sleeping), etc.

Upon reflection, I do have a recommendation for your exercises. Many of those books on Google or internet sources would give directions, but not explain the why of their decisions. You have thought through these things, as your response to my comments showed. I would recommend that you also explain those choices to the audience. It will allow them to make educated decisions about their own preferences. From the sources I've read these explanations are often missing, it is based as if solely on the individual experience. I'd had to read a number of them to find the patterns of what the individual experiences had in common. You are giving suggestions based on specific reasons; if these explanations were also there, it would seem more "up front" to me.

But then it depends on where you would want to go with this. There are a number of different branches of possibilities. I’m not sure where your interests lie in this, but I’m interested in hearing more as you work with this, or any exchange of ideas. I think research into this field of magic has a great deal of potential, not only in terms of self-development, but also in terms of manifestation itself. So thanks for sharing .

Stickied.Keep it coming folks,this is an excellent thread so far. [grin]

I wish people would keep it coming.

Please do share some of those scholarly articles, if you remember where they are (it's been ages since you posted that). There are so many I have bookmarked to go through, but if you have some favorites to skip ahead to, it would be very appreciated.

You can tell yourself to remember your dream before going to sleep.
You can also tell yourself to wake up at a specific time.
Neither of these work 100% of the time, so don't bet your important job interview on an internal alarm clock.
But they work far more often than you would think likely.

For best results, be gently forceful on your phrasing, and say it out loud. Tell yourself what you are going to do. Don't whisper, and say it with conviction. then go to sleep.

I once told my self "I need to, and will try to quit smoking from tomorrow." just before going to sleep.
I woke up only after couple hours of sleep, scared shitless not just to smoke, but too scared to ever go back to sleep. I was stayed up until morning with lights on for the rest of that night.
The moral of that story was: careful what you wish for, especially if you wish for it out loud.

Cerber wrote: ↑Mon Jan 11, 2021 12:23 am I once told my self "I need to, and will try to quit smoking from tomorrow." just before going to sleep.
I woke up only after couple hours of sleep, scared shitless not just to smoke, but too scared to ever go back to sleep. I was stayed up until morning with lights on for the rest of that night.
The moral of that story was: careful what you wish for, especially if you wish for it out loud.

I thought the moral of the story was that you told yourself you'd quit smoking, and then you did.
not sure where 'be careful' comes in?

But then "be careful" is not on my favorite phrases list. I guess I regard "be careful" as halfway between "be cautious" and "be fearful", and I align very easily with the former, but not with the latter.

I quit smoking due to a mantra i learned from a coworker. He didn't intend it as a mantra, I just adapted something he said into one.
I had been cutting back, trying to limit how much I smoked by not buying "packs" of smokes. So I was 'bumming' smokes... but that's not very fair if I never have any to bum-back, so i was buying them individually with a quarter (more than fair price at the time). Anyway, this one coworker had a very colorful mouth. I asked him if i could buy a smoke off him, and he was in a grumpy mood, so he just blurted out "bleep bleeping bleep Kate, if you're gonna bleeping quit, just bleeping quit and stop bleeping around about it, bleeping bleepity bleep". He gave me a smoke anyway, cuz he was 'actually' frustrated with something else, not me. So i smoked it, and that phrase was just kinda circling in my head. I kinda memorized it. I didn't finish the cigarette.

So I guess learning to cuss in my self affirmations was my trick to quitting smoking.

A woman complained to me about possession. She said the entity would make her steal money and buy cigarettes to give to friends. She said that the entity would delete her memory of the theft after about 5 minutes.

It seemed that the entity wanted its targets to use tobacco - as a means of reducing their resistance.

To me "be careful" can mean anything, or many thing, "be cautious" and "be fearful", and more. Depending on the situation, context, subject at hand. It means, to me at least, "take a moment to assess all the possibilities and probabilities, weighting all outcomes, before stepping in to something. Take in to account all that you know and all that you don't know.", "measure the rope 10 times before cutting.." or smth. I'm not very emotional person, so meanings of those terms in my mind don't carry any special emotional burdens, and in pure practical sense I don't see big gap between "be cautious" and "be fearful".

I did quit smoking at that time, for a week or so. Did quit few more times since then, usually lasting from week to few months. It's a habit I very much enjoy despite the negatives, so quitting it for good been too challenging so far. I love the taste and flavour of it and I don't mind slow and painful death few years down the line, what does bother me though is the cost of it, the price per pack on my island is an arm and a leg (feels like it at least).
Well and that it has very strong negative impact on my memory, mind clarity etc when it comes to meditations, AP, dreams etc, clogs the gears a lot. But that can be mitigated to an extent, with some "pre breathing" to oxygenate those gears a bit more, with meditations in the morning after sleep rather than at evening before sleep, or simply with more effort and time dedicated to practices, or even with brain hacks like "binaural beats" etc.

But still, I wholeheartedly agree, it's a terribly filthy habit..

Cerber wrote: ↑Tue Jan 19, 2021 2:47 pm it has very strong negative impact on my memory,

My friend reported that the entity rather than the tobacco was editing her memory.

A couple of decades ago I was in a relationship with a woman subject to spiritual oppression by dark forces. One day we were at the beach and a grayish entity turned up and put some rather pleasurable energy into us. So I allowed it into my light body.

A few days later I made a comment about the experience on a forum and shortly after had an obliging email pointing out that the entity had its own agenda contrary to my well-being. So I ejected the entity.

The entity was manipulating the pleasure chemicals in my physical body. The gray colour should have been a warning. (Some light from the galactic center is so high in frequency that lt looks dark to humans - like a black hole)

Since then I have been fooled a couple of times but am now much more sensitive to the slight feeling of unease in my light body. So when some bright-looking entity turns up and offers an upgrade to my light body and/or a live-in relationship, I do a staged process, giving clear instructions to my most trusted in-dweller to keep a sharp eye on the new-comer.

I recently did a clean-out of entities in my energy field that no longer meet my standards. The slimmer system feels much better.

The system of an Earth human includes trillions of intelligences to manifest and to operate the physical, emotional, mental, buddhic and atmic bodies. As the human refines its system there is a constant process of acquisition of higher frequency entities and discharge of lower frequency beings.

Amor wrote: ↑Tue Jan 19, 2021 10:50 pm

Cerber wrote: ↑Tue Jan 19, 2021 2:47 pm it has very strong negative impact on my memory,

My friend reported that the entity rather than the tobacco was editing her memory.

At the present we are not aware of any malicious, "unsanctioned" presence and/or connection to any of my "systems". We may have had few such times in the past, may even have to deal with such incursions in the future, but at least for a while now we have not registered any "disturbance in the force", yet.
The list of people who has access to my "internals" and all the wirings is very very short. And it got even shorter quite recently. I think we are ok for now.

Amor wrote: ↑Tue Jan 19, 2021 11:02 pm A couple of decades ago I was in a relationship with a woman subject to spiritual oppression by dark forces. One day we were at the beach and a grayish entity turned up and put some rather pleasurable energy into us. So I allowed it into my light body.

A few days later I made a comment about the experience on a forum and shortly after had an obliging email pointing out that the entity had its own agenda contrary to my well-being. So I ejected the entity.

The entity was manipulating the pleasure chemicals in my physical body. The gray colour should have been a warning. (Some light from the galactic center is so high in frequency that lt looks dark to humans - like a black hole)

Since then I have been fooled a couple of times but am now much more sensitive to the slight feeling of unease in my light body. So when some bright-looking entity turns up and offers an upgrade to my light body and/or a live-in relationship, I do a staged process, giving clear instructions to my most trusted in-dweller to keep a sharp eye on the new-comer.

I recently did a clean-out of entities in my energy field that no longer meet my standards. The slimmer system feels much better.

The system of an Earth human includes trillions of intelligences to manifest and to operate the physical, emotional, mental, buddhic and atmic bodies. As the human refines its system there is a constant process of acquisition of higher frequency entities and discharge of lower frequency beings.

I've experienced enough of such "interventions" that now I get paranoid whenever my mood or emotional state makes even a slight twitch, to either direction, to more positive or negative. The malice can dress in any colours, just because something feels nice, doesn't mean it's actually "good", and in my experience, usually it isn't.

Amor wrote: ↑Tue Jan 19, 2021 11:02 pm A couple of decades ago I was in a relationship with a woman subject to spiritual oppression by dark forces. One day we were at the beach and a grayish entity turned up and put some rather pleasurable energy into us. So I allowed it into my light body.

A few days later I made a comment about the experience on a forum and shortly after had an obliging email pointing out that the entity had its own agenda contrary to my well-being. So I ejected the entity.
...

Since then I have been fooled a couple of times but am now much more sensitive to the slight feeling of unease in my light body.
...

I recently did a clean-out of entities in my energy field that no longer meet my standards. The slimmer system feels much better.

...As the human refines its system there is a constant process of acquisition of higher frequency entities and discharge of lower frequency beings.

I'm just friendly to entities anymore, overtly so. I tap into their frequency and the thread of their true being, and match it within myself. And behave very chummy.
among more negative entities:
Some entities have ill intent, but lose interest in it when they feel understood and/or accepted as they are.
Some entities are a little bit driven away by friendliness.
Some entities become very nervous when treated overtly as a non-threat.
Some entities are kinda intimidated by the subtle inference "I know where you live"
Some entities genuinely enjoy a more positive interaction now & then.
Some entities see themselves mirrored in among the myriad threads of self, and aren't into being deliberately self destructive.
Most negative entities lose track of their predator/prey sense of dynamic when their overture of which role they'd like to play is not reciprocated. Or just feel disappointed at a lack of negative effect.
Some entities just want to go elsewhere if they realize you would be kinda intrigued by an interesting challenge, but don't really see them as one.

Some entities need a little extra push in their direction of thinking. A few realize this is the case, and reflect carefully when they realize I've been very minimalist about it.

As for sorts of energy ...every energy has it's place in the multiverse. And I'm pretty closely aligned with the multiverse as a whole. I don't regard any sort of energy as 'bad' exactly. This somewhat undercuts the whole 'conflict' dynamic.

Even just feeling very calm and at ease with an unwelcome overture can considerably re-frame things for an entity.

Also I had a dramatic decrease in negative entity events after one situation where a line was crossed, and I made an example. In hindsight it could have been a 'useful' negative interaction, as it tread into memories of events I don't cherish, so I probably under-examine them. The entity may have been a part of my own psyche even. But the way it played out was just not acceptable, and I pretty dramatically "put a head on a post". In my current state, I would have approached it somewhat more thoughtfully. Literally anything can be a learning experience. But it is what it is.

You meet all kinds of entities. But I haven't had an actual 'conflict' in quite a few years. Diplomacy is a fine art. But I'll grant it would be fairly hollow without the 'capacity' to be less civil. good cop / bad cop i guess. But mostly, just being at one with the 'all' tends to make friends rather than enemies. And being aligned towards a focal point of a grander whole of consciousness, doesn't really come across as an inviting target for ill intent.

Why not just make more of the energy in question, and give some back? it's the neighborly thing to do. You did say it was pleasurable.

I guess I lean more towards "I'm sorry, that can't coexist with my goals and interests, so that's not happening. But it's nice to meet you. Oh that's a delightful intimidation effect there. I like it. Especially that dark ominous fringing aroma at the edges, nice touch. But why so interested in me? Flattery will get you everywhere hehe. What brings you to my neck of the woods? Tell me about yourself." You know, being courteous to their sense of sovereign independent consciousness.

One must ask themselves, why an entity or energy seems alien or disenfranchising. What is it exactly which creates this emotional response? Purity is kind of a one-trick pony. A vast nature, is somewhat incongruent with being easily put off. Usually people are most put off by mirrors which show parts of themselves which they do not want to see. Not always, but it's a pretty common theme.

I agree definitely with a 'cleaned out' energy body though. It's a little bit tricky to define what is "outside influence" exactly, because really there is no absolute defining border between "I" and "other". Not that it's difficult to tell the difference, but literally that the difference depends entirely upon what 'scale' of self you regard it from. So it's kinda... a convoluted thing to approach. Helpful to imagine it as kinda cone-shaped, relative in scale to how much individual being-ness you're beholding it from. But certainly a more streamlined & focused/focus-able self is useful. And you want the energy body to meet the body-body in a way that's equally singular.

I dunno how much sense I'm making with the words I'm choosing. Picking a lot of words which seem not quite exactly right for what I mean. Which probably means "word salad" unfortunately. Or at best painting a somewhat distorted picture of what I'm thinking.

Cerber wrote: ↑Wed Jan 20, 2021 4:06 am At the present we are not aware of any malicious, "unsanctioned" presence and/or connection to any of my "systems". We may have had few such times in the past, may even have to deal with such incursions in the future, but at least for a while now we have not registered any "disturbance in the force", yet.
The list of people who has access to my "internals" and all the wirings is very very short. And it got even shorter quite recently. I think we are ok for now.

I've experienced enough of such "interventions" that now I get paranoid whenever my mood or emotional state makes even a slight twitch, to either direction, to more positive or negative. The malice can dress in any colours, just because something feels nice, doesn't mean it's actually "good", and in my experience, usually it isn't.

The above post I made is really in response to both of you, I had to pick a post to reply to though hehe.

I think i wanted to add though that this reminds me a little bit of meditation. That mirror-like still water of mind. And the value of tapping into the same for the energy body. Even though the energy body is not "still" exactly, with all of it's flowing and glowing. But it can be a mirror-like perfectly still reflection of what it is supposed to be, for the you which is entirely just the you at the finite end of the spectrum of self.

That last sentence being a very carefully worded thing.

Kath wrote: ↑Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:54 am That mirror-like still water of mind.

That reminds me that every human mind that I have inspected contains, in the middle subplane, that is, at the top of the personality mind, a shiny surface that screens off part of the mind space from the human thinker.

The shiny screen is one-way transparent, allowing another thinker to operate from behind the screen.

Typically when I look at such another thinker, it looks like a small human with dark glasses and cap pulled well down. It does not want its eyes to be seen.

The hidden thinker can be labelled as the personal will. It is the intent that drives the personality to get its act together. The hidden thinker needs the human personality to be integrated so that the hidden thinker can defend its self-esteem.

An obvious symptom is a human that does not like being wrong.

When the human learns to control its mind, that concealed entity comes out into the open and changes from self-defensive to community-creative.

So far that change is fairly uncommon, but increasing as the human race becomes more oriented to the greater good.

Kath wrote: ↑Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:46 am I'm just friendly to entities anymore, overtly so. I tap into their frequency and the thread of their true being, and match it within myself. And behave very chummy.
among more negative entities:
Some entities have ill intent, but lose interest in it when they feel understood and/or accepted as they are.
Some entities are a little bit driven away by friendliness.
Some entities become very nervous when treated overtly as a non-threat.
Some entities are kinda intimidated by the subtle inference "I know where you live"
Some entities genuinely enjoy a more positive interaction now & then.
Some entities see themselves mirrored in among the myriad threads of self, and aren't into being deliberately self destructive.
Most negative entities lose track of their predator/prey sense of dynamic when their overture of which role they'd like to play is not reciprocated. Or just feel disappointed at a lack of negative effect.
Some entities just want to go elsewhere if they realize you would be kinda intrigued by an interesting challenge, but don't really see them as one.

Some entities need a little extra push in their direction of thinking. A few realize this is the case, and reflect carefully when they realize I've been very minimalist about it.

As for sorts of energy ...every energy has it's place in the multiverse. And I'm pretty closely aligned with the multiverse as a whole. I don't regard any sort of energy as 'bad' exactly. This somewhat undercuts the whole 'conflict' dynamic.

Even just feeling very calm and at ease with an unwelcome overture can considerably re-frame things for an entity.

Also I had a dramatic decrease in negative entity events after one situation where a line was crossed, and I made an example. In hindsight it could have been a 'useful' negative interaction, as it tread into memories of events I don't cherish, so I probably under-examine them. The entity may have been a part of my own psyche even. But the way it played out was just not acceptable, and I pretty dramatically "put a head on a post". In my current state, I would have approached it somewhat more thoughtfully. Literally anything can be a learning experience. But it is what it is.

You meet all kinds of entities. But I haven't had an actual 'conflict' in quite a few years. Diplomacy is a fine art. But I'll grant it would be fairly hollow without the 'capacity' to be less civil. good cop / bad cop i guess. But mostly, just being at one with the 'all' tends to make friends rather than enemies. And being aligned towards a focal point of a grander whole of consciousness, doesn't really come across as an inviting target for ill intent.

Why not just make more of the energy in question, and give some back? it's the neighborly thing to do. You did say it was pleasurable.

I guess I lean more towards "I'm sorry, that can't coexist with my goals and interests, so that's not happening. But it's nice to meet you. Oh that's a delightful intimidation effect there. I like it. Especially that dark ominous fringing aroma at the edges, nice touch. But why so interested in me? Flattery will get you everywhere hehe. What brings you to my neck of the woods? Tell me about yourself." You know, being courteous to their sense of sovereign independent consciousness.

One must ask themselves, why an entity or energy seems alien or disenfranchising. What is it exactly which creates this emotional response? Purity is kind of a one-trick pony. A vast nature, is somewhat incongruent with being easily put off. Usually people are most put off by mirrors which show parts of themselves which they do not want to see. Not always, but it's a pretty common theme.

I agree definitely with a 'cleaned out' energy body though. It's a little bit tricky to define what is "outside influence" exactly, because really there is no absolute defining border between "I" and "other". Not that it's difficult to tell the difference, but literally that the difference depends entirely upon what 'scale' of self you regard it from. So it's kinda... a convoluted thing to approach. Helpful to imagine it as kinda cone-shaped, relative in scale to how much individual being-ness you're beholding it from. But certainly a more streamlined & focused/focus-able self is useful. And you want the energy body to meet the body-body in a way that's equally singular.

I dunno how much sense I'm making with the words I'm choosing. Picking a lot of words which seem not quite exactly right for what I mean. Which probably means "word salad" unfortunately. Or at best painting a somewhat distorted picture of what I'm thinking.

oh such a space hippy..

jk I know I'm exaggerating.
And actually I agree, mostly, in general. Because in general, it's very unlikely for generic person to go in to certain places, engage in certain activities where/when they would likely to encounter anything really "bad" in more general sense, by definition, far beyond just simply "disturbing", "uncomfortable", "misunderstood" etc.
From my own personal experience, absolute majority of so called "bad" experiences were simple "misunderstandings" of some kind. And often "bad" depends a lot individual at hand, personal conditioning and what not.
If a devoted Christian get a visit from some ubi entity, for whatever reason, that's bad, such tainted soul should jump out their bed and pray to their lord almighty to save their sinful soul from damnation.
On the other hand, if for example I get such guest, it's a ..

..no praying required.
Or just because some guest come wearing giant horns, or whatever else that's considered "not good" in their respective conditioning, I can't say it's not "bad" for them, maybe it is, for them specifically, maybe only for them. It hard to generalize and apply the same logic for everyone.
I have different conditioning, opposite to a lot of people, if I see an entity wearing white fluffy wings (figuratively, or literally), I don't think it's a blessing, I might go in to panic mode and press every big red button I can find, before asking any questions.

Different tastes..
..
Those bits aside, your list of "more negative entities", I would label "often misunderstood entities".
Sometimes "people" just trying to get attention, and sometimes their attempts manifest in some not very pleasant ways.
There was one time one person in my close circle at the time began having nightly bad dreams, and in general feeling not very well. While I avoid and refuse to go in to other people's "personal space" even if asked, for various reasons, that time my friend asked me enough times to get me finally say "ok I'll try", I didn't expect to get anything, I didn't think there was anything, I already had my diagnosis that's something minor and surely not even metaphysical, but I felt obliged to at least try, even if just so I could say the next day I tried and found nothing, which might help my friend to relax and stop being paranoid.
But to my surprise, on very first try, when I "entered" I actually found someone. I come in and see this girl sitting on a couch, with her arms and legs crossed. Face clearly not human, but dressed like some rebellious teen from 90s. And she was completely and absolutely focused on me, and not single muscle twitching, not a single word from her, just this weird field, or beam of something radiating from her, some "field of extreme annoyance" or something. And I just had this feeling, all she wants is just some attention. So the next day, we gave her "platform to speak", in a way, my small group collectively focused on her, and the moment all our antennas turned to her, she just dumped her story on us and left, and we never heard from her again. And that friend of mine instantly went back to normal, on every aspect.

I haven't done anything, except record some story, which had not much meaning or purpose for us, but seems like it was important for someone it to be heard, seen, recorded. So it seems there are times, by this and some similar stories, when others can annoy us a little in all kinds of ways in an attempt to get our attentions, for whatever reason.
And to the same "misunderstandings" list I put most of vamps (or entities of that and similar nature), while they can cause harm of some sort, unintentionally, they usually are very reasonable. I've had entities with the most (can't find the right and polite terms) "aesthetically unusual appearances"(?) sitting down with me with a cup of tea, taking time and effort to explain to me their intentions, their purpose and everything else, in the most respectful and intelligent ways, even more so than I could ever hope to get from any human being I know. And kindly asking me if I could possibly help them get where they need to be.

Most "people" seem to be quire reasonable and kind out there. Even if very different, in their behaviour, appearances, morals and the way they see them selves, others, and the world.

But then there are other kinds of "people". What I would consider a bit more on the "negative side".
Like entities, which were "born" or "engineered" for sole purpose to torment, to wreck havoc, who's existence for that sole purpose. Chimeras made of gods knows what. Some of those can actually kill, not directly, but are programmed to find the way to remove "their victim" of the surface of this and they are relentless like machines. While some of those no larger than racoon (not necessarily literally), others can have really complex personalities, with deep memories of this that never really happened, but simply a story was written deep in to them by those that brought them in to existence.
There are entities that simply can't be reasoned with, they are just like some giant rolling blob hunger, constantly probing every gap with their army of tentacles, seeking for victims to latch on and suck the life out of them, or at least as much as they can, from as many as they can. Some of those have names, some of those can be invited by simply mentioning their name.
From my experience, while most can be reasoned with and understood, and there usually is some common ground to be found. There still are much "darker" (subjectively) layers of our reality, infested with all kinds of unpleasant things.

Cerber wrote: ↑Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:06 am stuff

Maybe slightly hippie
but somewhat not. more than one side to a coin.

I don't think it matters if an entity is "genuinely negative" or not. I'm fine chilling with whatever. If it exists, some part of me can most likely get along with it. Never assume the other entity is the scariest thing in the room.

There are beings though, whom if you merely match their resonance, it will definitely lead to conflict. I guess that makes their hostility kinda hypocritical, if you think about it. But a scorpion will sting the frog, it's just what scorpions do.

Most interactions between sentiences follow a pattern of reciprocation. A incites B incites C incites D...
In many cases, conflict avoidance is more an act of assertion than one of being affable.
But one can be 'affably assertive'.

A incites B who says "no", and instead creates a different game to play, without saying it really, just by not cooperating with the foreseen narrative in the mind of the other being, and instead asserting a different exchange. I'm not turning the other cheek in mindless victimhood, but more ignoring their presumed agency in what will transpire.

A simpler entity would think it very friendly. Oh you're not afraid, your're not reactionary, you're not biased, etc. All true. I know it's in the scorpion's nature to sting, but is that not how a scorpion is meant to be? But a large minded entity would perhaps realize that on a subtle level, I'm prying from their hand control of the situation as well. Although merely realizing it wouldn't be enough to easily resist. It's not all smoke & mirrors, ultimately it carries the kernel of truth that I really am curious and desire a pleasant outcome, and am eager to understand them better.

Either way, bringing thoughts and motivations and true will to the fore kinda also lays their intent bare and drags them onto my turf. Should it become absolutely necessary to be uncourteous.

Randomly or arbitrarily hostile entities I think only get powerful/skilled to a certain level. They might bring a lot of energy, but their mind is not vast and they lack agility in their will.

There is a subtext, that not only am I not even slightly distraught, but one some level I'm treating their hostile overture as "interesting". That I don't treat their hostility as worth responding in kind, there's a vaguely ominous message buried in that. Diplomacy has many levels.

I dunno, nobody has come around looking to tussle in a very long time. quite the opposite of my growing up. My input may be rusty. But even without any subtext, and meta-level mind games, a smile goes a long way I think.



Probably worth noting... that while I would never recommend any sort of visceral fear, a novice should maybe not try to get scary things to stay for tea.

Kath wrote: ↑Sun Jan 24, 2021 11:39 pm

Cerber wrote: ↑Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:06 am stuff

..
Probably worth noting... that while I would never recommend any sort of visceral fear, a novice should maybe not try to get scary things to stay for tea.

"Scary things" is such mean term, so unexpected to hear it from someone who's advocating for peaceful coexistence and mutual understanding between all forms of life.. tsk tsk..
Few times I would run to one of my friends after some exciting encounter, and be like "Oh my gods, I met this amazing person, she/he looks amazing, so beautiful, looked like this and like that, and here, I even found similar picture.." and they're like "uh that looks scary." and I'm like "huh? what you're talking about? why you are so rude?..".. Yeah I stopped talking about a lot of what I see and meet with others.
I mean, beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder, or how does that saying goes.
I don't advocate fear, per se, but neither I advocate "unconditional love and acceptance", I advocate caution and awareness, or ideally mental and emotional stillness, self discipline, and kindness. Appearance usually does not indicate ill intentions. And at least in my personal space negative words like scary or even ugly etc are completely banned from usage.