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Hi,
I´ve been reading on Judaism, but when I learned about the coming of the Messiah I thought that it is really bad: most people would die and the rest would be judged, and the people that would die I think would not even exist anymore. Some things make me think that Yahveh actually exists, but then how can the coming of the Messiah be stopped?

If you assume that their is truth in the theology of the Hebrew Scriptures and Rabbinical writings then it would be impossible for any single, or even all humans combined, to effect the outcomes which Jehovah has preordained.

You will have to make your own decision as to how much validity you want to grant literal readings of these texts. But, if 'fear' is your basis then it will only drag you down deeper. Perhaps the claims of the Koran are true and if you don't bow to Allah then you'll go to Hell. Or, in the Bhagavatam (Canto 5) it says that those who eat meat are reincarnated on planets where they are eaten and cooked alive in the manner they cooked animals so maybe you should throw out the frozen turkey and worship Lord Vishnu.

I don´t worry about myself, I can be holy and be saved according to any religion. I could even live according to the Jewish rules. But what about the others? Therefore I have to stop the whole thing. But of course, maybe I can´t.
I don´t think that one species can reincarnate in another, I think that we are told that so that we aren´t cruel to animals. We shouldn´t be cruel to animals because they have feelings.
Anyway the End of the World and the Messianic Era seems to contradict when Yahveh says that he rewards until the thousandth generation: there would be then at least 15000 years more.

According to your typical Doomsday tradition, I think the whole idea is that nothing can stop it.

I definitely wouldn't be worried about it, in any case. There's no counting the number of cultures that had a prediction for the end of the world, complete with fire and brimstone, lightning storms, giant serpents, dragons, gods know what else, and all of these cultures eventually go extinct seeing their prophecies unfulfilled.

Even if you were convinced that the end of the world was coming, as according to for example, the Jewish tradition, would that actually change anything? I don't think I'd personally feel inclined to convert to orthodox Judaism, simply because I don't like the Jewish God, and living according to his rules would be roughly equivalent to Hell for me.

Bring on the end of the world! Never got overly attached to this place anyway. :p

Converting would only help myself, not everyone else. In that case I would have to oppose him. But the End now would contradict the Torah anyway. It can´t happen until many thousands of years without making a lie of the word of Yahveh. There is plenty of time.
Anyway, he is very violent, I need another god.

Prometeo wrote:Hi,
I´ve been reading on Judaism, but when I learned about the coming of the Messiah I thought that it is really bad: most people would die and the rest would be judged, and the people that would die I think would not even exist anymore. Some things make me think that Yahveh actually exists, but then how can the coming of the Messiah be stopped?

Why bother about end of the world? Sooner or later everyone have to die anyway.

you will have to wait a little bit.
some people think there are still 15 years left.
http://www.ep.liu.se/ecp/096/050/ecp14096050.pdf
then you can be a holy warrior and safe our poor souls.

You need a great siddhis to stop it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siddhi
Or you must make an evocation of a powerful higher being.

"most people would die and the rest would be judged"

Sounds good to me.

Lumpino wrote:You need a great siddhis to stop it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siddhi
Or you must make an evocation of a powerful higher being.

Are you sure you don't mean Lord Sithis?

I think the apocalypse is much needed and won't be stopped anymore. The planet needs to cleanse itself from us. Nature will adapt. Developed humanity won't.

I think we should read Greer and Grey - to prepare and adapt.

There is ways to prevent this, still, such as reversing the damage we are doing as a species, but IMHO, it is a very large likelihood that wont occur.

Even now the apocalyptic keys are being worked by several practioners to try and illustrate the amount of damage that is already done in the hopes of shocking people awake to prevent full on disaster, but at this point a rebalance of the world soul seems to be inevitable.

Too much ego, too little planet to go around.

Meh, if the book of Revelations were true in the literal it would be the only explanation as to why no one's been able to get a grip on how things are sliding - ie. it would be deliberate, inevitable, essentially 'rigged' to occur.

The thing that always jumped out at me is that higher planes could, at any time, give us the working intellectual materials to solve our own problems even if they're incredibly puritanical about our putting in the work ourselves. It seems like what's done the most damage is the number of people running around all over the place looking for answers, not finding them, and the few who do are a somewhat trifling number to stem the tide of the world's problems.

The sign of what the divine allows or endoreses, in history's currents, is that something happens at the right times, under the right conditions, and a political movement, ideological movement, rational/scientific, or religious movement catches like fire. Watching that today it seems like theists are fighting against the current of where things are going.

Sometimes I can't help the feeling that even if nothing comes in the way of locusts, brimstone, or mass polar meltdown we're at a time of rare freedom between two caliphates - one being the Catholic and then Protestant fundamentalisms and the next being atheist fundamentalism that will chase down any theistic and magic beliefs with just as much churlishness as the iron curtain. I say that because watching the crowds it seems like few people really 'get' anything new and so the masses are in transition from one grand misadventure to the next. That rare freedom we have right now is sheer amount of high quality occult and mystic material free on the net in pdf form, available on kindle, etc. etc.. and perhaps even before I thought about it this way it was part of why I ended up on a huge reading binge; ie. the sense that all of this easy availability could be gone or highly regulated against as a subversive 'theism' as opposed to a totalitarian statism.

When you think about it, the amount of material that's out there right now - can you imagine what we would have given in previous days and ages, or perhaps even future times, to have access to what we do right now providing that we can get past either of the two competing kool-aids (fundamentalist theism and fundamentalist atheism) to make use of it? It gives me pause for thought when I consider that proposition of reincarnational purpose.

No stopping the end of the world. Simply put, regardless of religious belief, someday the sun will go supernova and destroy the earth so why worry about it?

Frater_VP wrote:No stopping the end of the world. Simply put, regardless of religious belief, someday the sun will go supernova and destroy the earth so why worry about it?

Yes, but after a very long time.

Judgement?! Just fairy tales bro, to keep the children among us in line and to prevent them from thinking for themselves. YOU are your own worst enemy and the guy next to you is your second worse enemy. Everyone wants to look under the plate that the foods on. don't worry. There's nothing hidden under it!

I wish I could agree with Manonthepath, but unfortunately, judgement is real, and is coming our way. Whether it is imposed / assisted by the gods and spirits or otherwise is irrelevant, and it won't care whether you are religious, spiritual, or secular/an athiest.

The nail is already being hammered into the coffin. It will be our own fault for poisoning our world with nuclear radiation, filling our seas full of plastic and oil, and pumping the atmosphere full of carbon dioxide. Whether man can actually fix the mess that he has imposed remains to be seen, but it won't be without a large scale loss of life, in my opinion.

Sypheara wrote:I wish I could agree with Manonthepath, but unfortunately, judgement is real, and is coming our way. Whether it is imposed / assisted by the gods and spirits or otherwise is irrelevant, and it won't care whether you are religious, spiritual, or secular/an athiest.

The nail is already being hammered into the coffin. It will be our own fault for poisoning our world with nuclear radiation, filling our seas full of plastic and oil, and pumping the atmosphere full of carbon dioxide. Whether man can actually fix the mess that he has imposed remains to be seen, but it won't be without a large scale loss of life, in my opinion.

I'm not sure if you're referring to judgement or to some natural result of stimuli. there is a difference you know?

Why would you want to stop it? It's called the rapture for a reason.