OccultForum.org

What is the first technique a newbie should know.
The absolute fucking basic.

I think it depends on the paradigm they are working in, but the first thing that came to my mind was meditation posture. Maybe developing a balance of critical thinking and open-mindedness is more important than posture.

Desecrated wrote:What is the first technique a newbie should know.
The absolute fucking basic.

Learning how to think probably?
By observing other speciman of my kind that one seems surpringly difficult for homo sapiens.

Ramscha

Learning how to think, critical thinking and so on, is a really really tall order. I'm talking baby steps here.

How would you start to learn how to think. what is it that prevents you from thinking. What different elements is there to thinking and can you break them down into exercises.

Hmm, baby steps? Hmm, lets go a bit into detail then. Lets assume our beginner alreay knows how to set on leg in front of the other, knows how to use a fork without hurting himself and into which opening the food belongs and where it comes out. So basically the cognitive standards [crazy]

Hmm, now what prevents one from thinking straight, I guess that would be distraction.
Not sure if I understand what you mean with "elements" of thinking. I would say it starts with the input, both from inside and outside. "I am hungry, thirsty, stop hitting me with this iron bar it hurts, I have ot take a piss, etc." Processing and taking according action would be one thing to learn as one of the first ones. This will develope for a while.

In the meantime it might be possible to develope some sort of awareness where all this input goes into. What is this thing I let take the actions, this "me"? So we would probably go for the focus on oneself next, observing, processing and learning.

And so on and so on. It that what you meant?

Ramscha

Always reflect on why other people say what they say. How do they benefit? What are their biases? How did they come to believe those things? What are good reasons to believe or disbelieve them? Fact check everything.

Reflect on your own biases and desires. Why are you inclined to believe or disbelieve something? What types of ideas do you enjoy the most, and what are your mind most closed-off to? Imagine how a completely neutral observer would judge you if they witnessed your thinking patterns.

Reading Dion Fortune's book Sane Occultism is another thing you can do.

Break yourself free of the dogmas and cultural programming of your upbringing. If you are a strict republican, become a democrat for a while so you can learn and understand why they believe what they do. If you're Christian, try to see why Satanism really isn't really the biggest evil in the world. If you are homophobic because your parents were, learn about LBGT culture and try to figure out why they fight so hard as they do. If you're afraid of heights because you fell down the stairs once, think about going sky diving.

I've been doing this since I was a child. In the old LHP Tantras, this was an important initiation. Find your Taboos and, rather than being ruled by them, destroy them and earn your freedom. Like when Crowley jumped into a Nettle patch to figure out why his dad said he shouldn't. Question everything, be ruled by nothing.

Do not shackle yourself to the bondage of Belief. There is such a thing as objective reality, and no matter what your personal ideas or your personal beliefs are, something simply either is or it isn't, works or doesn't, and is true of false. This has nothing to do with dualistic philosophy. If you pull the trigger of a gun, it will either fire a bullet or it will not. Believing that the gun will fire a bullet will mean nothing if there are no bullets in the gun for it to fire.

When you have done these things and you have claimed your mind and your ideas as your own, whatever those ideas are, then you are ready to learn the Sacred Craft of Magic.

And either during or after that, learn Posture.



~:Shin:~

Ramscha wrote:
Hmm, now what prevents one from thinking straight, I guess that would be distraction.

In the meantime it might be possible to develope some sort of awareness where all this input goes into. What is this thing I let take the actions, this "me"? So we would probably go for the focus on oneself next, observing, processing and learning.

Okey, how do we get rid of distraction?

How do we develop that awareness?

Frumens wrote:Always reflect on why other people say what they say. How do they benefit? What are their biases? How did they come to believe those things? What are good reasons to believe or disbelieve them? Fact check everything.

How do we reflect on things the best. Any good reflection techniques?

Reflect on your own biases and desires. Why are you inclined to believe or disbelieve something? What types of ideas do you enjoy the most, and what are your mind most closed-off to? Imagine how a completely neutral observer would judge you if they witnessed your thinking patterns.

I found it extremely helpful to study HOW we think.
This is a good webpage that helps you challenge your self.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/

Desecrated wrote:

Ramscha wrote:
Hmm, now what prevents one from thinking straight, I guess that would be distraction.

In the meantime it might be possible to develope some sort of awareness where all this input goes into. What is this thing I let take the actions, this "me"? So we would probably go for the focus on oneself next, observing, processing and learning.

Okey, how do we get rid of distraction?

How do we develop that awareness?

Well, how do you get rid of distractions? You avoid them, erase them or ignore them, depends on the distraction [wink]

And how do you develope the awareness? As I said you start to observe this meat suit with it head controll center, how it/you react, what it does and how it acts. I guess that starts the question of reflecting on those things. If there is a good technique? Well, name the point you are standing like "When A happens, I do B". What consequences might action B bring with it, how is it connected to the circumstances, why did you do action B instead of action C? Then you start from this point to look for connections forming a more detailed picture. One part at a time, no rush [lol] Taking notes and drawing some scetches of the known points ore points in question is also helpful.

But I have the feeling that we are turning in circles, could that be?

Ramscha

Desecrated wrote:Okey, how do we get rid of distraction?

Meditation.

Desecrated wrote:How do we develop that awareness?

Another sort of meditation.

Mental Discipline and Awareness Development are both covered in the article I posted recently.

Desecrated wrote:How do we reflect on things the best. Any good reflection techniques?

Introspection, which I posted the aforementioned article as an exercise called Internal Awareness.

What Frumens is calling for there is less a matter of reflection and more a matter of discernment, though. In short, take nothing at face value. Assume nothing, question everything. If you wouldn't take a used car salesman at his word (and you probably shouldn't), don't take every self-proclaimed occultist at his word, either. Instead, study him and figure out if he's trustworthy or not, if he has good sources for his knowledge or if he makes things up as he goes along, and all that. Think about those things instead of just believing what everyone says, or else you'll find yourself in the corner of the internet where they discuss the huge underground draconian city-base in New Mexico and how Hitler escaped to Antarctica.



~:Shin:~

How do we reflect on things the best. Any good reflection techniques?

Practice putting yourself in others' shoes. If you were Frumens why would you have a desire to participate on this forum? Based on Frumens' posts, what can you infer about his knowledge of the occult? How does he communicate with others? Does he speak authoritatively, or is he more of a passive participant in conversations? Does he seem humble, or arrogant? How do other members of the forum relate to him, and why do they act that way? In which topics is he knowledgeable, and in which is he ignorant? How did he acquire his knowledge? How much experience does he claim to have, and does it reflect in his posts? What are good reasons not to believe him? Does he have biases regarding certain topics? How crazy are the things he says? Does he seem like a well-adjusted person?

Before you spend money on any occult related stuff, ask yourself, "What are some reasons this might be a scam?" Before you listen to an occult teacher, examine their personality, their personal history if you can, and list reasons why you should or shouldn't trust them. Is the teacher going down a path that you want to follow? Learn to recognize the warning signs for cults.

After you have an occult experience, take a step back and think about what just happened. What is the difference between reality, imagination, and hallucination? In what ways might you be deluding yourself? Definitely don't believe something just because you heard it from a disembodied entity.

Reflect on why you want to study the occult. Do you want to change something in your life, and if so, why? Are you on a quest for knowledge, and if so, why? Do you want to acquire power, and if so, why? Regularly ask yourself, "Is what I'm doing bringing me closer to my goals?"

I found it extremely helpful to study HOW we think.
This is a good webpage that helps you challenge your self.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/

I liked that link. Thanks.

Ramscha wrote:

Desecrated wrote:

Ramscha wrote:
Hmm, now what prevents one from thinking straight, I guess that would be distraction.

In the meantime it might be possible to develope some sort of awareness where all this input goes into. What is this thing I let take the actions, this "me"? So we would probably go for the focus on oneself next, observing, processing and learning.

Okey, how do we get rid of distraction?

How do we develop that awareness?

Well, how do you get rid of distractions? You avoid them, erase them or ignore them, depends on the distraction [wink]

And how do you develope the awareness? As I said you start to observe this meat suit with it head controll center, how it/you react, what it does and how it acts. I guess that starts the question of reflecting on those things. If there is a good technique? Well, name the point you are standing like "When A happens, I do B". What consequences might action B bring with it, how is it connected to the circumstances, why did you do action B instead of action C? Then you start from this point to look for connections forming a more detailed picture. One part at a time, no rush [lol] Taking notes and drawing some scetches of the known points ore points in question is also helpful.

But I have the feeling that we are turning in circles, could that be?

Ramscha

Observe it from the inside, or observe it from the outside using visualization?

Shinichi wrote:

Desecrated wrote:Okey, how do we get rid of distraction?

Meditation.

Desecrated wrote:How do we develop that awareness?

Another sort of meditation.

Mental Discipline and Awareness Development are both covered in the article I posted recently.

Desecrated wrote:How do we reflect on things the best. Any good reflection techniques?

Introspection, which I posted the aforementioned article as an exercise called Internal Awareness.

What Frumens is calling for there is less a matter of reflection and more a matter of discernment, though. In short, take nothing at face value. Assume nothing, question everything. If you wouldn't take a used car salesman at his word (and you probably shouldn't), don't take every self-proclaimed occultist at his word, either. Instead, study him and figure out if he's trustworthy or not, if he has good sources for his knowledge or if he makes things up as he goes along, and all that. Think about those things instead of just believing what everyone says, or else you'll find yourself in the corner of the internet where they discuss the huge underground draconian city-base in New Mexico and how Hitler escaped to Antarctica.

Is this the article you are talking about:

http://www.occultforum.org/forum/viewto ... ne#p490000

Selfobservation

Desecrated wrote: Is this the article you are talking about:

http://www.occultforum.org/forum/viewto ... ne#p490000

That would be the only one I've posted, so yes.



~:Shin:~

Shinichi wrote:Break yourself free of the dogmas and cultural programming of your upbringing. If you are a strict republican, become a democrat for a while so you can learn and understand why they believe what they do. If you're Christian, try to see why Satanism really isn't really the biggest evil in the world. If you are homophobic because your parents were, learn about LBGT culture and try to figure out why they fight so hard as they do. If you're afraid of heights because you fell down the stairs once, think about going sky diving.

I've been doing this since I was a child. In the old LHP Tantras, this was an important initiation. Find your Taboos and, rather than being ruled by them, destroy them and earn your freedom. Like when Crowley jumped into a Nettle patch to figure out why his dad said he shouldn't. Question everything, be ruled by nothing.

Do not shackle yourself to the bondage of Belief. There is such a thing as objective reality, and no matter what your personal ideas or your personal beliefs are, something simply either is or it isn't, works or doesn't, and is true of false. This has nothing to do with dualistic philosophy. If you pull the trigger of a gun, it will either fire a bullet or it will not. Believing that the gun will fire a bullet will mean nothing if there are no bullets in the gun for it to fire.

When you have done these things and you have claimed your mind and your ideas as your own, whatever those ideas are, then you are ready to learn the Sacred Craft of Magic.

And either during or after that, learn Posture.



~:Shin:~

This was amazing. I agree completelly