Jesus & Satan painting?

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Jesus & Satan painting?

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Original post: [Gnostic]a+

lucifer was demonized by the orthodoxies... to us gnostics lucifer is the shadow of the christ... our inner being.

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Jesus & Satan painting?

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Original post: TheRealMethuselah

Satan == Lucifer;
END OF LINE;

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Jesus & Satan painting?

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Original post: Specktackular

[QUOTE=TheRealMethuselah]Satan == Lucifer;
END OF LINE;[/QUOTE]
Your signature: "12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!"

... Do you understand that verse? It is not referring to a spirit being, not Lucifer or Satan. It's been a while since I used the mathematical symbol "= =" so perhaps what you are saying is Lucifer != Satan (Lucifer is not Satan), which is correct.

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Jesus & Satan painting?

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Original post: Specktackular

[QUOTE=Isyron]what's the difference between Lucifer and Satan? Feel free to PM me with the answer. Sorry.
[/QUOTE] Quite simply, they have nothing to do with each other. "Lucifer" was a Greek concept that appears once in some bibles as a mere mistranslation during a verse referring to a human Babylonian king. The two pantheons are completely unrelated, which goes quite a way in showing the "authenticity" of the King James Bible.

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Jesus & Satan painting?

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Original post: ShekinahMoon
Specktackular wrote:Quite simply, they have nothing to do with each other. "Lucifer" was a Greek concept that appears once in some bibles as a mere mistranslation during a verse referring to a human Babylonian king. The two pantheons are completely unrelated, which goes quite a way in showing the "authenticity" of the King James Bible.
I was about to debate this but I went looking online for some information and found this on Catholic Encyclopedia. Now I'm confused.

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09410a.htm



The name Lucifer originally denotes the planet Venus, emphasizing its brilliance. The Vulgate employs the word also for "the light of the morning" (Job 11:17), "the signs of the zodiac" (Job 38:32), and "the aurora" (Psalm 109:3). Metaphorically, the word is applied to the King of Babylon (Isaiah 14:12) as preeminent among the princes of his time; to the high priest Simon son of Onias (Ecclesiasticus 50:6), for his surpassing virtue, to the glory of heaven (Apocalypse 2:28 ), by reason of its excellency; finally to Jesus Christ himself (II Petr. 1:19; Apocalypse 22:16; the "Exultet" of Holy Saturday) the true light of our spiritual life. The Syriac version and the version of Aquila derive the Hebrew noun helel from the verb yalal, "to lament"; St. Jerome agrees with them (In Isaiah 1:14), and makes Lucifer the name of the principal fallen angel who must lament the loss of his original glory bright as the morning star. In Christian tradition this meaning of Lucifer has prevailed; the Fathers maintain that Lucifer is not the proper name of the devil, but denotes only the state from which he has fallen (Petavius, De Angelis, III, iii, 4).

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Original post: pmcv

TheRealMethuselah

Satan == Lucifer;
END OF LINE;


No, not in here it isn't. We are dealing with older definitions that the ones people today are used to. The equation between Satan and Lucifer did not exist yet in the time of early Gnosticism.

ShekinahMoon


I was about to debate this but I went looking online for some information and found this on Catholic Encyclopedia. Now I'm confused.


I actually posted a rather long history of the word "Lucifer" somewhere else on these forums, but rather than go looking for it I think maybe it is good to recap here.

It is true that the word "lucifer" seems to have been used to talk about the planet Venus in it's morning position. Or, at least the Greek term "phosphorus" was, and it could be translated into the word "lucifer". I have seen a number of claims about religious usages of "Lucifer" as a propper name in early latin "witchcraft" (The so called "stregharia", which is actually a modern movement rather than an ancient one), but in fact I have never seen an actual historical source that did so, and the modern sources I have seen are dubius at best. However, perhaps somebody here can list an ancient Latin usage that I havent seen or have forgotton about.

No accurate Bible translation today actually has the name "Lucifer" in it. The word first appeared in the latin "Vulgate" a translation by Jerome. Jerome was having a dispute with a Bishop named Lucifer, and seems to have written the name into his translation as an attack on this bishop (though perhaps it really was an ignorant mistranslation on Jerome's part, I doubt it). The passage that Jerome wrote this translation as "Lucifer" in, whic is the one in TheRealMethuselah's signature, is actually about Nebuchednezzar, not Satan. It is only after Jerome's translation that the word "Lucifer" enters the Christian vocabulary as another name for Satan. Jerome's translation also presented other problems, such as the fact that Jesus is equated with the Morning Star (phosphorus or lucifer) in Rev 16:22.

In Gnostic texts there are a number of "Light Bearers", in most cases four. These could be called "lucifers", but this is obviously a designation rather than a name. Just to be clear on this, the common claim that "Lucifer" is a Gnostic god is false... there is no Gnostic text that uses the name "Lucifer".

PMCV

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Original post: frater luciferi

yeah, as a luciferian we would agree with the gnostics interpritation of who lucifer is- although to us we consider lucifer to be the sort of christ-figure ie morningstar that came to free us from the evil tyrant god. anyways i came back to this thread to post a link to a picture that also depicts the tempation of christ- although its a bit different as far as the clothing that satan was wearing- the priestly garb and all that- what is that about?

http://www.imagesonline.bl.uk/britishli ... t=18&idx=2

and thank you pcmv and the others who would clarify this. I find myself a lot of the time continually explaining over and over these very basic same facts. It should be common knowledge within the occult as far as the name lucifer goes. Beyond its infamy i see it slighted just as much as the eastern swastika was maligned by its relation to the nazis. Lucifer was actually a pretty common roman name throughout history- ie the bishop lucifer of whom othodoxos wrote a text about his sect- in the dialouge against the luciferians-ie catholic followers of this priest. which to me would point to the fact that IF a catholic priest was named LUCIFER at any point it would denote the simple fact that the connotation of the word was changed after a theological invention by whom? my theorum relates this to bishop lucifers arch rival no other then jerome who was responsible for the translation of the bible into the latin. sigh.... i don't mean to be off topic but hopefully i can arm a few other occultists with some juicy facts-

for example jesus is referred to over and over as the morning star in the new testament. We all know that lucifer is another word for morning star. Therefor if you were to say that the text in the old testament relates an actual fall you would have to say that jesus was lucifer. ok i am done. Sorry pcmv if i disrupted this thread in any way.

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Original post: Space Debris

[QUOTE=frater luciferi]anyways i came back to this thread to post a link to a picture that also depicts the tempation of christ- although its a bit different as far as the clothing that satan was wearing- the priestly garb and all that- what is that about?[/QUOTE] I think this depiction of Satan, in which he wears what appears to be monk's robes and holds an object that looks like a rosary, may be an attack on the corrupt state of the medieval Church.

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Original post: Shepard of Arcadia
In Gnostic texts there are a number of "Light Bearers", in most cases four. These could be called "lucifers", but this is obviously a designation rather than a name.

In this way Abraxas, Gamaliel and perhaps even Christ can be considered "Lucifers".

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Jesus & Satan painting?

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Original post: [Gnostic]a+

jesus IS lucifer


jesus said:


Revelations 2:28 - And I will give him the morning star.

Revelations
22:16 - I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, [and] the bright and morning star.

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Original post: Jenfucius

I have speculated that too. Dont know if its true as I havnt really investigated it enough but it does sound like an interesting concept never the less.

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Jesus & Satan painting?

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Original post: Specktackular

[QUOTE='[Gnostic]a+']jesus IS lucifer


jesus said:


Revelations 2:28 - And I will give him the morning star.

Revelations
22:16 - I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, [and] the bright and morning star.[/QUOTE]

Perhaps this referred to the "son of man" (seed) per new moon. Makes a lot more sense (to me) than trying to make sense of a mistranslation. Remember where the term "Lucifer" originates.

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Original post: siggy79

In the time of jesus women were considered unclean, evil, or inferior. Society has been changing to accept women as equal to men. How do we know if satan is just misunderstood as women were. Night/day woman/man good/evil - We cannot choose night or day we cannot choose to be a man or a women- it just is.

What about good and evil? We all know inside of us are places of good and evil, If God created us in his own image, then God also has places of good and evil inside him. None of us are all good and all evil, We are both.

You could say that the rain which fell on people who's crops did not grow was 'good' you could also say that the rain which fell upon the ground, flooded and killed many people was 'evil' but in reality it is just rain.

Jesus and satan could be the battle within God himself. Jesus could be man satan could be woman, or jesus could be women and satan could be man.

Either way there is a place for both on this earth.

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Original post: [Gnostic]a+

" being distinguished from qualities delivereth us "

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Original post: Alexander3

I saw a couple of years ago a painting depicting a sleeping Christ and Satan is sitting next to him with a crown of fire.He is holding a spear and seems to be contemplating.I googled every Temptation of Christ pic i can find with no luck.Does anyone know of this piece of art?It seems to be an older painting like baroque or renaissance.Thanks for any help.

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Original post: Manifesto

Image

if u look close, it appears that only jesus is being directly in "thought" with lucifer/satan/or who ever you call the horned figure. No one else seem's to pay attention to him minus jesus, and also jesus seems to be the only pair of feet on the stand. and the black clothed figures, im not sure. all this is speculation, but they appear to me as "occultist" the way they sit back and observ the happens and seem to have a look of "i know whats going on here" on their faces.

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