Bardon's IIH students. The phenomena at the end of the book

[Horny Goat]

Followers of franz bardon, working your way through this book, have any of you produced any of the following phenomena; creation of artificial spirits; volting, by any method and to what end; the creation and use of magic mirrors and the phenomena contained in step 9; any of the phenomena in step 10?

I know that there are plenty of people who've done the work. What results from the back end of the book are you getting? What phenomena can you produce now? It would be great to hear. Thanks.

[Horny Goat]

I regret that I asked this question now. It's been up a week and has been read only a few times with no responses. In posting such questions I'm taking without giving. In future I shall try to give instead. Sorry.

All of the phenomena at the back end of the book IIH are real. None of them are exclusive to Bardon's system of magick. The creation of artificial spirits has been performed by many magickians. Volting is merely results magick - a very common practice. The work with the magick mirror; many of it's different applications have been done by other magickians. It's techniques such as distant influence over others are standard fare for magickians. The phenomena of chapter ten: It's true that the mango tree miracle seems hard but the others aren't so. Even the raising of the dead is a relatively simple matter and well within the realm of possibility. These things aren't as hard as many imagine.

In future then, I shall try to contribute rather than merely request.

[Cybernetic_Jazz]

It might be that we have very few people who can really comment to that level on this site. When I first saw this I was very interested but I realized I actually had questions for you rather than answers and I didn't want to derail the topic.

That said if you have gotten through the ten steps of Bardon's program that's a huge accomplishment and congrats on that. If you read William Mistele's books on the elemental kings and queens it's clear that you'll have a lot of truly fascinating adventures coming your way in Bardon's PME.

[manofsands]

There's also the point that many may have not the read said book. I haven't. I hope you don't think you're being ingnored. It doesn't happen often.

[Horny Goat]

Cybernetic jazz, no, you're getting the wrong end of the stick. I haven't worked my way through this book. I'VE READ IT!. Ha ha. I've read it. Not done it. Sorry. I'm no adept. I was asking questions of others. Please don't ask much from me. I'm not even on step one. Sorry for confusion.

[Aunt Clair]

Summary of Exercises of Step IX
1. Magic Mental Training:
1. Practice of clairvoyance with the help of magic mirrors
a. seeing through time and space
b. distant effect through the magic mirror
c. different tasks of projection through the magic mirror
II. Magic Psychic Training:
1. Deliberate separation of the astral body from the material body
2. Impregnation of the astral body with the four divine fundamental qualities.
III. Magic Physical Training:
1. Treatment of the sick with the electromagnetic fluid (Yes healing becomes stronger as the magickian continues to ascend in vibration)

2. Magical loading of the astral body with the four divine fundamental qualities
(yes, the magickian learns to load the astral body with divine elemental treasures ie Shen , Chi, Ching and Xie
but Bardon is not as exacting in his language herein)

3. Wish-realization through electromagnetic volts.
End of Step IX

Summary of Exercises of Step X
I. Magic Mental Training:
1. Elevation of the spirit to higher levels. (Yes Kether, Shamballah)

II. Magic Psychic Training:
1. Conscious communication with the personal God. (Yes; Henios and Unio Mystica albeit for a brief time)
2. Communication with deities &c. (Yes; Mahatma and Christ, Buddha, Yemaja, Rhiannon, et al)

III. Magic Physical Training:
1. Several methods for acquiring magic faculties. (Yes, but Bardon's methods of dousing eyeballs in chamomile baths do not seem to work for anyone; clairvoyance is developed by past life vibration and the development of energy flow, pathworking, kundalini events, attunements and practice in general in altered states of trance)
End of Step X

[Desecrated]

Not read it.
Ordering it now.

[Frumens]

I just watched some YouTube videos by Rawn Clark, one of the people who claims to have completed IIH. He said that if Jesus really existed it was terribly irresponsible for him to perform high calibre miracles in public. A responsible initiate would have kept their silence. I would love to see Bardonian adept flaunt their stuff as much as the next person, but it we may need to accept and respect their vow of silence.

[NariusV]

I've worked some of the beginning steps of IIH, but it's personal application that matters. If anyone is following though on the whole work and to the letter they most likely won't be responding to a forum post.

There are groups of people who do the work and talk with each other. I don't know of any though so I can't help there.

[Cybernetic_Jazz]

It seems, at least to me, that someone has to be in a very unique place in their life to go from almost scratch to picking up Bardon's IIH and getting through the 10 steps as prescribed - the book saying jump, them saying 'How high?', and that being held to consistently.

Add to that the companion books advise keeping complete thought-silence for two hours a day. They suggest also that you don't move beyond step one until you can hold at least half an hour to 45 minutes of absolute mental silence at will, worst case passing with a C- is 2 thoughts in 30 minutes.

I actually did try that, I tried the recommendation of doing my black-and-white mirror with 100 white, 100 black (ie. strong points vs. self-criticisms) and TBH the way I found out that I just wasn't ready was this; the two hour no-thought sessions seemed to be imbalancing, for several weeks I was able to do it but it was like being on a fad diet - ie. keeping it up got harder not easier. Similarly with any times where I decided I'd try to do a quietness meditation. On a good day with full determination to do just that - 30 minutes with few if any thoughts - works prestinely, the moment it becomes a routine - the daydreams just start sprouting up from all directions, it then becomes 20 minutes of daydream with "Yeahyeahyeah, I'll thought-clear in the last 10" - at that point the product is worse than useless, it's injurious to one's concept of meditation.

I'm really thinking it's like this - most people can do Bardon IIH if they have a good amount of esoteric and meditative pre-game. I could see Eckhart Tolle's 'Power of Now' applied diligently being a great precursor for the Bardon work. I'm in two mystic orders hoping that some of my development there will help also get me to a place where I wouldn't be a leisure-stroll kind of outdoorsman all of a sudden trying to run a 10k with no practice; that's really what it seems like as the Bardon stuff just about seems like.

The challenge is remembering that we only have a certain daily, weekly, and monthly motivation. If we overspend then we have no consistent change in habits - we just have a binge of one sort or another and then a relapse when your nervous system and generally your self-complex can't afford the upkeep anymore. I might try at the Bardon system again one of these days but, at least in my own case, it looks more like something I'd want to take a try at after maybe 10 or 15 years of lighter and more achievable occult development/growth. Thankfully I know that what I have on my plate for that 10 or 15 years I can do and quite likely, my take on this being the Great Work, within the context of eternal existance the 40, 50, or more years I most likely have left affords plenty of room. It's suggested that once you acquire cosmic consciousness it's yours from then on - I'm willing to take the risk that they're bluffing over never getting there at all I suppose.

[Frumens]

Add to that the companion books advise keeping complete thought-silence for two hours a day. They suggest also that you don't move beyond step one until you can hold at least half an hour to 45 minutes of absolute mental silence at will, worst case passing with a C- is 2 thoughts in 30 minutes.

The Divine Science people are the only ones who recommend that. Rawn Clark recommends that you not follow their super intense yogic style, because the point of the book is not to be stuck at step one forever. William Mistele recommends you be thoughtless for 15 to 30 minutes by the time you reach step eight, not one.

[Cybernetic_Jazz]

The Divine Science people are the only ones who recommend that. Rawn Clark recommends that you not follow their super intense yogic style, because the point of the book is not to be stuck at step one forever. William Mistele recommends you be thoughtless for 15 to 30 minutes by the time you reach step eight, not one.

Is that where Chris Murphy (Fr Veos) is coming from? I have both his and Rawn Clark's commentary and I remember these (half hour minimum, 100 black/white, etc.) being Chris's suggestions - can't remember how much Rawn's opinion differed - I'd have to go back and re-read that part of A Bardon Companion.

[Frumens]

The Divine Science people are the only ones who recommend that. Rawn Clark recommends that you not follow their super intense yogic style, because the point of the book is not to be stuck at step one forever. William Mistele recommends you be thoughtless for 15 to 30 minutes by the time you reach step eight, not one.

Is that where Chris Murphy (Fr Veos) is coming from? I have both his and Rawn Clark's commentary and I remember these (half hour minimum, 100 black/white, etc.) being Chris's suggestions - can't remember how much Rawn's opinion differed - I'd have to go back and re-read that part of A Bardon Companion.

Yes, Chris Murphy/Veos is one of the guys who runs the Divine Science. After reading Murphy's commentary Clark disagreed and said you don't need to exceed Bardon's original instructions. He said this in a recent YouTube video, not in A Bardon Companion. Clark's style is a lot more relaxed overall.

[Cybernetic_Jazz]

Nice. I'll keep hold of it and perhaps even get PME and KTK in case time should free up when I'm further down the road.

To make a long story short with me I joined AMORC and BOTA last fall and I can see that BOTA is going to have me extremely busy for the next 13 years at minimum, probably a good 10 years or more of that after 'graduating' the first 16 courses, AMORC promises 12 temple degrees but I hear Sumum Bonum goes up through 30 years of start date (so a bit like tacking on 23 years to the maybe 7 for 12th temple?). I may or may not take an interlude in that time, possible as well that a lot of very similar subject matter will get covered or that I'll be able to come up with a good pigeon between Bardon's TOL and Case's TOL or between Bardon's magnetic/electric work with the Roscicrucian healing and energy theories that supposedly come down hard and fast in 6th temple. For at least the next ten years though I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be able to literally take all the steps in serial order as directed by the book just because of how many visualization, energy, and meditation exercises I'll be getting bombarded with but I could at least use it to sort of keep track of where I'm at in development as compared to the steps referenced in IIH.

All the same I get the impression they'll be extremely helpful books and, if I remember right, if someone can look at IIH and can check most of the boxes off up through the 8th step in terms of what is recommended as necessary for moving on to PME and KTK (whether achieved from IIH directly or by other means), they can jump into that material without following the prior coursework to the letter so long as they understand the safety issues well enough. It reminds me of how William Mistele in his Undines book had a friend who after hearing Willliam talk about Istiphul decided to contact her herself, had some great hang-time with her, and I don't remember hearing anything about her being an IIH grad but perhaps just someone of a similar level of development in one respect or another.