Original post: spiritoflove
Hello,
I was wondering is it possible to tell someone when they are going to die, by the use of astrology?
As in when the Sun within the chart gets blacked out by the Death Planet...'
Another thing if you knew would you go out if it said that you were going to die on a street in your 40th year...lol...?
If we can tell someone their time and way they will die, like you can always look back after someone died and pinpoint the planets to the death, could you also go forwards to the next life, as well as backwards into past lives???
In Profound Peace
Spirit of Love
Death By Astrology!!!
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Death By Astrology!!!
Original post: Arianstar
Hi, first off, there is so many ways a death can be read in a chart, but its also contridictorial. meaning, one configuration in a chart, can mean a totally different theme in circumstances at the moment of death. Its basically hard to predict unless you have the right tools, and I assure you, they are different then what clear cut, say a planet most often aspecting another in a malefic planet, dealing with the statistics of similar death instances. It is defiently circumstantial, not all patterns of similar deaths denote thats how you die, if its hitting a senstive configuaration. There is a way to get close to the answer, that is the understanding and intepretation of the hyleg, and the Alchocoden. But dont ask me, about that one, I didnt research on that one, anyhow, to learn more click below on the link, hopefully you will find out what your looking for. Also here is a 14 page article on death and astrology on a whole diferent note.
http://gonzo3.homestead.com/death1.html
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I'm sure just the title of this article will probably make it one of the most sent 'round the Internet articles of all time. Everyone is fascinated and repelled by death. Most people are repulsed and frightened that someone could predict their time of death and so, will read this from a macabre standpoint even if it scares them out of their wits. I'll warn you ahead of time, this will be a tongue-in-cheek article to an extent, although the information is viable.
Let's establish some ground rules here. I've been a medical astrologer since 1975 and I deal in sickness and death. I'm interested in dispelling some of the myths about what astrology can and cannot do -- especially in the realm of predicting one's death. Since I work in a rarefied field known as medical astrology, I see a lot of chronic illness and my fair share of dying and death along the way--the two are compatible and natural. Here's what I've found so far:
Myths that seem to just perpetuate regardless... about death and astrology...
1. Any astrologer who says they can predict your time of death is dead wrong. Get rid of 'em. Fire 'em. They're on an Ego trip at YOUR expense (literally and figuratively because you're paying money to this person to tell you such things). They are scaring you, manipulating you and you should get good and mad at them, report them to a national astrological organization and leave their services--pronto. No human being can tell you when you're going to opt out of this bag of bones and skin--only your soul knows that.
2. Don't ask any PROFESSIONAL astrologer to tell you when you're going to die. First of all, a professional will tell you up front they can't do it. Secondly, if they have a moral compass and integrity, they wouldn't tell you even if they did know! Why? Because your time of death is in YOUR hands, not the astrologer's. And hopefully, your astrologer has the wisdom and humility to admit this to you up front. and no astrologer is clairvoyant enough to see such things. Clairvoyance is highly dependent upon choices made by the person--not the astrologer. If clairvoyancy was all it was cracked up to be--then a clairvoyant would be accurate a hundred percent of the time, all the time--but they ain't. Why? Because of choice you plugged in, changed or modified through your own soul/sub-conscious.
I've been offered thousands of dollars to do just that from time to time--and I turned down all requests. I've heard some pretty persuasive arguments as to why I should tell what I know (and this is after telling the individual I could NOT point to the day of the death). One client said it was an investment in the future of his grandchildren--if he knew when he was going to die, he could set up his will at the appropriate time for them. Another was a husband who wanted to make sure his wife would be provided for--just in case something 'sudden' happened to him. I've had them beg, cry, plead, curse, threaten, lure and promise me many, many things over the years if I would only tell these individuals when they'd die. In every case, I've said "no."
3. You cannot "die" on a transit. I can't tell you how many frightened student astrologers who knew just enough to scare themselves silly, have called me over the years think that their 'death' was arriving shortly in the form of a heavy transit from Saturn, Uranus, Neptune or Pluto.
No one can die on transit. It has to be backed up in the progressions, firstly. And there may be 'other' indicator present, such as an eclipse, plus a transit. These two or three pieces to the recipe for Death must be in place before something serious and major happens. Nothing major happens on a transit. Everything major occurs with progressions.
4. And no, Saturn isn't the only death planet indicator. It is one of many, as you will see. Any and all the planets, including the Uranian ones, can be involved in a death.
5. And no, just because you have a transit, progression or eclipse in your 8th house (known as the house of sex, taxes and death, thanks to Scorpio ruling it), does not mean you're gonna check out either. Any house in the natal chart, any of the twelve, can be implicated and involved in your death.
6. And no, it isn't just hard aspects such as a conjunction, square, inconjunct or opposition that can put you into another dimension. So can soft aspects such as a sextile and trine, too. And there isn't one aspect that is a 'death aspect', either.
7. Eclipses are not going to kill you. In and of themselves, they never will. In order to die, you must have progressions set up. An eclipse MIGHT be a trigger for this to occur, but that is all.
8. There isn't just one death aspect opportunity in your natal chart--there is, roughly 4-8, depending upon the individual. I'm sure that won't help some people sleep well. "Gee, I have eight opportunities to die instead of just one....." and I can see the wheels turning on this one as to how to find them and when are they gonna happen?
9. Lately, Chiron is getting a myth started on this asteroid that it's Death's Door. No, it isn't. A Chiron transit can certainly bring transformation--but it doesn't mean dying physically.
10. The Moon's Nodes are the major indicator of dying. Not really. They may or may not be implicated in a death. In my work, they are so wishy-washy along this line that I look at them only as a secondary or third party in such crisis. I've found them 'active' in potential physical death only about 30% of the time--and that's not a very high statistic to count on.
So, those are the myths. And please (please) don't go around using them as death indicators because they won't work.
Some observations and experience...
I like to look at potential death aspects as windows of opportunity. Because people have set upfour to eightdifferent windows when they can die, it's hard for an astrologer to pick which one you are going to choose to leave on.
In our business as medical astrologers (and my associate, Rosemarie Brown will also parrot this), we like to use 'terms' that don't stampede our clients. Terms such as "window of opportunity" or a "crisis." Crisis simple means the energies come to an apex or focal point to physically occur and manifest--that does not mean dying!
Look at death as the following: consider the chrysalis of a butterfly. We live in a chrysalis, this human body of ours, this bag of bones we call "home." Death liberates and frees us, like a butterfly emerging from this cocoon, so that we can literally, fly free.
Death, in our business, is a window opportunity just like a birth is--there is no difference. In one, the spirit is being placed in the chrysalis (birth). In the other, the spirit is being freed of this chrysalis (death). Ask your astral body which it prefers and it will unequivocally tell you it prefers to be out of your bag of bones you call home!
We call these times in your progressed chart "windows of opportunity." Now, the only question we have to talk to you about is this: what is going to die? We know it will either be a spiritual, mental, emotional or physical death. Right there, it's a 4:1 odds against us choosing if you're going to leave your home for good or if there's an attitude that is outdated, worn out and an "old tape" from childhood that will die a death, instead. Or, maybe it's an emotion from the past that you've finally matured beyond and it's time to put it out of its misery, instead. Perhaps the belief system you were imprinted with as a child, has outgrown you and now, you're ready to embrace a different belief system--so the old spiritual cornerstone dies to leave a place for a newer, better model, instead. This is why an astrologer cannot accurately predict your time of death--this energy may well play out spiritually, mentally or emotionally instead--and you're still breathing after it occurs!
We may also call these windows "a crisis." There are any number of crisis in your life. You'll lose count. I know I have. A crisis simply means that something is coming to a head; the pressure is on and something is gonna move come hell or high water. And "something" will. One of the many possibilities is dying; but it's pretty remote on a scale of 1 to 10.
The Truth About Death Aspects
Now that we've swept away the myths and the old wives tales about being able to predict one's death via astrology, let me share with you what I do know, that is accurate and that does work.
1. ANY planet can be involved in a death aspect.
2. ANY aspect can be involved in a death.
3. Progression is 'where the action is at' and the windows of opportunity or crisis will certainly emerge.
4. There is no ONE signature for death. There are so many I could write a book on them (and I'm not going to), the possibilities endless (just as human beings are individualized, so are their deaths), that even when I see a strong window/crisis, I know that the soul of that person can take that energy and its eventual manifestation and expression and turn it into some kind of incredible, transformative opportunity.
Some Examples of Death
From my files, I make "notes" on things. Hen scratchings would be another way to look at it. As a medical astrologer, I'm a junkyard dog from the standpoint that I do not use one system. Typical Gemini/Pisces that I am, I use what works for me and this is the framework of what we are going to related and speak within.
First of all, I use Tropical astrology with a Koch house system. For progressions, where the real action is at, I use the 90-degree Cosmobiology wheel. I progress with average solar arc. I add the Transneptunian or Uranian planets. Their names are: Hades, Admetos, Kronos, Poseidon, Zeus, Apollon, Cupido and Vulcanus. Many of you may recognize these as Greek myth figures--which they are.
Midpoint structures are crucial. Without them, I couldn't do the type of work I do. With this "recipe" I have a 95% accuracy on forecasting health/medical events. In my business, you want accuracy above all because I'm dealing with serious dis-ease and potentially life/death situations or implications.
It is from this amalgam that I'm going to share some notes on deaths that actually took place. I'll make the appropriate comments after I share the particular aspects are shared. These two charts I have, over the years, lost the birth data--so please don't ask for it--and these are "hen scratchings" about the cases and the aspects/midpoint structures I found at the time of the occurrence. Both these cases were back in the early 70's--a long time ago, but they fit the bill with what I want to share with you in this article, regardless.
Case Number 1
This individual is of a man who had an argument with his wife. He was 24 years old when he died. He and the wife climbed into a jeep and he drove off at high speed. The jeep over turned and killed both of them. Just for clarification for our beginning/budding astrologers, I'm going to be using the following "shorthand" : P. means progressed planet. T. means a transit (daily movement) of a planet. N. means a natal planet in that person's chart. It takes a combination of a natal planet being "triggered" by a progressed planet (figured out with solar arc) and a transit(s) to be the catalyst to create action or an event/crisis/window of opportunity.
I'll be talking about Uranian Planets (yet another article in and of itself--but we will be tackling these on astro weeks in the future in the medical astrology portion).
Here are the aspects for the male that set up at the time of his death:
P. Midheaven
N. Hades/Venus ----------N. Uranus
Comment: This particular midpoint has the man's MC or Midheaven sitting between his Natal Hades and Venus on one side of the 90-degree dial and his Natal Uranus on the other side.
Interpretation: N. Venus/Hades--this person is going to have some love-life and love related problems that need to be disintegrated (Hades) so that it can be solved or resolved. A person's Midheaven is their Ego (outer/conscious) and how they want others to see them. If the Ego gets stepped on the wrong way, projections abound as a result. Uranus is about sudden things happening. They can be catalytic. They can be accidents (but it will be a strange, twisted kind of accident--a 'dumb' thing or 'weird' thing that occurs). Uranus rules over airplanes and flying. As I understand it, the jeep rolled off a cliff and 'flew' about three-hundred feet before hitting the bottom.
This guy was having love-relation problems that came to a head suddenly and he got is Ego bent out of shape and he went and did something stupid--like driving off at high speed while angry.
N. Uranus
N. Saturn --------P. Midheaven
The natal Uranus is at the midpoint between his natal Saturn and his progressed Midheaven.
Comment: Something catalytic and sudden/unexpected could happen (Uranus) and it hit old patterns of behavior and old ways of reacting/responding (Saturn) and his Ego (Midheaven) got pulled into this. He had a choice as to how he responded. Instead of a mature (Saturn) response, he went into his rebellious teenage temper tantrum (Uranus) and did his Ego trip thing. It got him killed, as a result.
Interpretation: There was lots of choices with this particular midpoint structure. He was given the opportunity to approach this love-relationship problem maturely (Saturn) but he CHOSE (see, there's that word again....) instead, to become rebellious (Uranus) and "I'll show you" (Midheaven).
N. Vulcanus/Node
N. Saturn -------------P. Pluto
This midpoint structure has Vulcanus (volcanic) and the nodes (north and south) sitting in the middle of it. Natal Saturn is on one side and progressed Pluto, on the other side.
Comment: Whatever was going to happen, was going to be "big" because Vulcanus is equated with a "volcano" exploding. The explosion, however, is defined. Vulcanus acts like an "adverbial" function to whatever it aspects. What does this mean? It means instead of having a Nodal energy of 1, it is 10. So that means that connections, either new connections (north) or dissolving of old connections (south) were highly emphasized in his chart for that night. With Natal Saturn, it was hoping he'd choose the mature avenue or approach to this. Saturn is often about endings, too. Or creating boundaries within which to operate. It is about restrictions. Pluto is about transformation.
Interpretation:: This guy had a real chance to make a break through that night. What was his choice? Breakdown. Of course, breaking down creates a break through, also. Maybe not the one you and I would have chosen--but we get choices thrown at us 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. His choice was to "explode" in this argument with his wife. He chose to transform the situation by leaving it--permanently. Of course, he could have broken it up (Nodes and Saturn) permanently by making some changes (Pluto) for his wife or their marriage. Vulcanus was asking him to transform (Pluto) the relationship (Node) for good (Saturn) and put it on a new and better footing. For whatever reason, he didn't choose to utilize the energy in that expression. He chose another expression of it: blowing up (Vulcanus), and transforming (Pluto) himself and his wife with finality (Saturn).
N. Vulcanus/Nodes
N. Hades/Venus ----------------N. Mars/Pluto
Comment: Here we have Vulcanus and the Nodes at the midpoint of his natal Hades/Venus (problems in love life) and natal Mars/Pluto tied up into this "dance." To be sure, there was going to be a catalytic (Pluto) explosion (Vulcanus) regarding a relationship (Venus/Nodes) that could end with a loss of one's temper (Mars/anger) that would lead to disaster (Hades).
Interpretation: There is no doubt that connections (Nodes) with people, in this case, his marriage, was going to undergo some powerful, transformative (Pluto) changes. It did involve his love life (Venus) and instead of using Mars as a directed energy of change, he chose to mirror the anger aspect of it instead (Mars). Consequently, he blew up (Vulcanus) in a temper (Mars) and hopped into his jeep (Mars) in an ugly, vile mood (Hades) and killed himself (Nodes/Hades/Pluto) and his wife (Venus).
P. Ascendant
N. Mars ---------N. Pluto
This is the man's ascendant which is about the people around him in his life at the midpoint structure of his natal Mars and natal Pluto.
Comment: Our Ascendant is our "overcoat"--it is our Persona or mask that we wear to the outside world. It is not our private self (that is our Moon), nor is "us" (that is our Sun). It's a facet or mask of ourselves that we feel comfortable wearing when we feel vulnerable, threatened or feel that we need this "shield" out in front of us to make us feel okay in a certain situation. The ascendant mirrors the people around us and in our life, in general. It can be our co-workers, the stranger on the street we pass, the person we ride next to on the subway, etc. With Mars and Pluto involved, this is showing us that someone around him (in this case his wife) is asking him to make some changes in himself. The question is: will he? And how?
Interpretation: The people in this guy's life were actively (Mars) asking him to change (Pluto). Whether he does or doesn't, is a choice he has to make. Whatever his wife said to him, triggered him off in such a way that he made several very bad choices down the line that got them both killed. His choice in this situation was not to actively (Mars) change (Pluto) but to end it (Nodes/Pluto/Hades) permanently.
P. Pluto
N. Hades -----N. Venus
We have progressed Pluto at the midpoint between his natal Hades and Venus.
Comment: This particular midpoint structure is asking him to change and transform (Pluto) a messy, deteriorating (Hades) marriage (Venus) and get it on the 'right' track instead or to sever (Pluto/Hades) the marriage/love relationship (Venus) forever (Pluto).
Interpretation: Its obvious to a professional astrologer that this midpoint structure is about how he feels/sees/regards his love-life and marriage relationship with his wife (Venus). It was in a state of gradual deterioration (Hades--"dust to dust") and that he was going to do something transformative (Pluto) about it. I don't believe he went into this argument with his wife with the intent of killing her and himself. I believe it got out of hand (Pluto) and he chose his destructive side (Hades) to "get even" with his wife for bringing up the ills of their marriage or things that needed to be repaired in their marriage to make it viable and ongoing between them (Venus).
N. Saturn
P. Mars/N. Pluto
This is an "opposition" on the 90 degree dial; or it appears to be and in "real life" on a 360 degree natal chart, it would involve a cardinal planet (Saturn) with two fixed planets (Mars/Pluto) and in actuality, could be a square aspect. But on a 90-degree dial, they show up as an "opposition". The man's natal Saturn is in a powerful opposition energy with progressed Mars which is conjuncting his natal Pluto simultaneously.
Comment: Any time we want to see "where the action is" in a person's life, we always look at the progressed Sun and Mars. These two planets (luminary and planet) are the key "triggers" to very important life choices and changes. It doesn't necessarily mean death and dying--one of these is always present in major life events/crisis, from getting a job, a birth, a death, a change of fortunes, a move, etc.
This young man came in and set up this situation; this tension between his natal Saturn and Pluto to see if he could master, overcome and work through it in a more mature way this time. Or, perhaps, this was one of those windows/crisis points where he'd either accomplished all that he could in this lifetime, and he was opting out. Or, he was way off his life track that his soul wanted to learn, and was opting out early because there was no way to get back on track, at least in this life time, so his soul "pulled the plug" so he could leave, to start again, in another life down the line. Many possibilities are presented with this configuration.
Interpretation: I call Saturn-Pluto the "put up or shut up" time in our lives. We all own this in one way or another. It's: "Lay your cards on the table, make your choice and whatever you choose--you're stuck with." Another way to look at this is: "Well, make a choice. Whatever it is, you lie in bed with it." (You made your bed, now lie in it). This doesn't have to be negative in the least. Saturn-Pluto is about make a powerful, slow, gradual evolutionary change at the soul level. Most of us do this without getting dramatic about it and flipping a jeep over and flying down a cliff and killing ourselves.
However, this young man chose NOT to act with maturity (Saturn) and decided to transform (Pluto) himself and his wife and it was expressed through anger (Mars) and testosterone (Mars/Pluto) in a very finalizing (Pluto) way.
You can see that ALL these aspects were in motion at the time of his death. You can also see that he had a lot of choices--and he made 'em. He had OTHER choices, too, that he disregarded. This could easily have been a powerful window of opportunity to transform his marriage. Well, what does that mean? It meant he could stay in the marriage, made the personal, transformative changes that were necessary to keep it viable OR he could get a divorce and go on with his life without her. It certainly did not have to end in death of both individuals. An astrologer would certainly have seen the 'crisis' in his chart and I'm sure, would have warned him beforehand of not losing his temper and being careful of accidents occurring. But to say: You're gonna die. No. None of us could have said with 100% finality--"Yep, this is your day to die, son." It was a day for him to transform, was all. The CHOICES he made, took it, in my opinion, to the "worst case scenario" instead of a more probable, hopeful, living outcome. Each soul has choices to make, however and we, as astrologers, certainly cannot know ahead of time if this guy was going to act like an infantile teenager with hormones/testosterone/hurt Ego and drive off like a maniac and get "even" with his wife in this argument. Those were all free will choices he put into play.
Case #2: Death of the Father in the Son's Chart
This particular case, the son was called by his mother that his father had passed away in his sleep. The mother had gone in that morning (they slept in separate rooms) to wake him up, and he was dead. Ultimately, the Sheriff suspected the mother of killing the father (she didn't) and an autopsy was performed to find out the cause of death (cancer) by the country medical examiner. Here's what the son's 90-degree dial solar arc progressed chart looked like that afternoon he received the call from his mother:
P. Saturn
N. Midheaven ---------N. Hades
Comment: Here we have two natal planets and you can see it is the progression that "triggers" off this event in the son's chart.
Interpretation: The MC (Midheaven), the Ego, the Self for this lifetime is engaged with Hades (dissolvement, "dust to dust"). Saturn, this time, becomes the Timekeeper (Father Time is one of his symbols) and in the son's chart is saying: something is coming to pass with finality. Time is up. It will affect the son directly (Midheaven). Interestingly, there was no love-loss between father and son, so when the son got the call, he was not in a state of grief then or later. The Hades in his chart was mirroring the dissolving of some THING in his life--and Saturn is certainly a symbol of the father in all our charts--or an older man (be it uncle, cousin, nephew, etc.).
P. Kronos
N. Saturn/Venus ---------N. Moon
Here we have progressed Kronos at the midpoint of the son's natal Saturn/Venus and his Moon.
Comment: Kronos is always about one's peer group. In this case, the sheriff's department, a government body, is stepping in. Kronos can also symbolize the father, since, in Greek mythology, Kronos was the father of Saturn. Usually it means a government body who has control or power with or over us (like the IRS, as an example). The peer group, Kronos is at the midpoint between the son's Saturn/Venus and his Moon.
INTERPRETATION: A government body was going play an important part in the son's life (Kronos). His mother (Moon) was thought to be a murderer (Saturn/Venus) and of course, this upset the son emotionally (Moon) a lot more than his father's passing. Someone he loved (Venus) was potentially going to prison (Saturn) and put there by the sheriff (Kronos).
P. Admetos/N. Node
N. Saturn/Venus
Progressed Admetos was conjuncting the Nodes in the son's chart and in 'opposition' was to this was his natal Saturn and Venus.
Comment: Admetos deals with hidden agendas, hidden things and information that is in the "dark" for a period of time. It was conjunct the Nodes (connections) and it mean that something that was in the dark, would be manifested by either a connection to something new (rebirth) or a loss of a connection (death). Added to this was an "opposition" to his Saturn (father) and Venus (love of mother). And also, his dealing with an unloving father (Saturn/Venus).
Interpretation: Admetos is like fog, or like the film that is being developed in the dark room of life. It is the subconscious, it is hidden, it is not obvious. With P. Admetos to the son's Nodes, it mean that a connection could either be forged (north node) or lost and disconnected (south node) and in this case, it was the mysterious passing (Nodes) of his father (Saturn) in his sleep (Admetos). And this passing involved a loved one (father and mother, although he said he did not love his father). The fact the father died in his sleep is very Admetos-like. The fact his father died of cancer, but it took an autopsy, is all about Admetos. Detective work of some kind may involve anything with an active Admetos in it, as it was in the son's chart.
The promise of a good outcome was the Venus in this configuration. Venus, in this case, promised a fortunate or happy end to a murky (Admetos) situation.
P. Sun/N. Uranus
Again, the main "trigger" planets, either the Sun or Mars, if involved in a progressed situation, means an important event that will alter the person forever, is going to occur. Many astrologers, looking at this, would predict an "accident" or "surgery" (Uranus) for the person who owned this chart (the son). However, it did not energy manifest in this way--and one would have to look at the above other configurations to perhaps come to a different conclusion. There was a "death by accident" here--but it was not the son--it was his father's sudden, unexpected passing, for no one knew he had cancer until the autopsy! The Sun/Uranus provided "surprises" for the son. It did not provide him an accident or surgery.
Planets Involved in Death
As you can see now, there are many types of "death" and that just because certain planets set up in configuration and aspect does not mean that the person is going to croak! As in the son's chart, it meant the death of the father in his life. The "death" of his emotional chasm with his father was passing. Now, the son would have to deal with a lot of suppressed emotions regarding how he felt toward his father. Nevertheless, it was an emotional death for the son, not a physical one.
In the other example, it was a physical death of the man and his wife. However, this could have played out much differently on three other levels, too. Choices that we make in an instant can change our lives on any one of these four levels, or, perhaps all of them. The key here is: choices are in our hands. Not the astrologer "reading" the chart.
Saturn
Saturn is often seen as Father Time--when your time's up--you're going. Father Time is here for all of us. We are all going to die some day. However, we move through many "mini-deaths" throughout our lives on the spiritual, emotional and mental level, too. And Father Time does erode our body so that when we're in our sixties, our body does not function as a twenty-year old's will, too. Saturn is about boundaries. You can either run into a brick wall, literally with Saturn, and kill yourself with it, or you can go around the wall, climb it or work through the wall, brick by brick. Its your choice on how you handle Saturn's energy.
A Saturn death is a lingering death. It doesn't happen quickly; it happens over time. Sometimes, a long, suffering time. Saturn is one of the planet's of longevity in one's life, also. The good side of Saturn, so to speak. A conjunction, sextile or trine between this planet and your Sun can give you a long, long life, although the whole chart must be taken into consideration for this.
Uranus
Uranus is implicated in surgery and accidents. Usually accidents of a "weird" or unusual nature--such as sky diving, bungee jumping, while you're skiing you run into and hit a tree and kill yourself--or some other loopy, dumb kind of thing that no one would ever think could happen and create an accident. Uranus also rules airplanes and flight--whether its in a single-engine airplane, a commercial jet, an ultra light or parachute/sky diving kind of "flight." It also rules over lightning and electricity--so many people get a jolt--either by a cord, by a lightning bolt or zapped through some strange, odd way. Surgery is co-ruled with Uranus along with Mars. With Uranus, you can have a "weird" car accident, or unexpected surgery (minor or major, depending upon the rest of the progressed chart).
A Uranus death is always sudden. There is no lingering on with this planet.
Neptune
Drug over doses, recreation drug death, death by Strep A flesh eating bacteria, by a nasty virus, or by prescription or over-the-counter drugs fall underNeptune's massive pervue. Drowning accidents figure prominently here, as well. Water related deaths or near deaths always find Neptune and Admetos active at the time. Of course, there is death by drowning of having too much fluid in your lungs; drowning by suffocation. Chronic Obstructive Pulmonary Disease, such as asthma, bronchitis, pneumonia and emphysema areNeptune's rulership as well. Anything having to do with water inside or outside the body isNeptune's base of operation. It could be a flood that kills someone. Or a flood of liquid, such as blood in the pericardial sac that surrounds the heart and stops the heart from beating. Deaths or near deaths that haveNeptuneprominently figured will always have a cloak of mystery about them, too. In some cases, no one will ever really know how it happened or what the person died of or from.
People with an activeNeptuneat the time of their death will usually die in their sleep (a lovely way to go). Or, they will die of suffocation (more than likely, lack of oxygen and perfusion, which means they simply can fall asleep and not wake up in this dimension again). A nice trine from one's Sun toNeptunemeans a quiet, gentle passing in one's sleep. No muss, no fuss. The "ultimate" way to go.
Pluto
Transformation is asked for by this planet. Can you change? If you can, you won't die. But you can die trying, too, although I've really not seen this with Pluto. There can be the slow death of an attitude, an emotion or feeling, of a spiritual way of looking at things, or a physical, bodily death. My experience with this planet is that if you're WILLING to transform/evolve/do the changes asked of you (and we're talking slow changes here--not immediate or abrupt ones as you'll find with Uranus), then Pluto is going to support you through this time period. You will come out the other end of a Pluto time older, wiser and better off. Or, you can dig in your heels, refuse to move/grow/transform and then Pluto will 'push back' and you can take off for another dimension--but again--it's your choice. Pluto deaths are usually pretty final and not always pretty. They usually involve massive trauma to the body, or there's little left to identify or its hard to identify.
Deaths with Pluto can be violent; and a good example of this is the heart attack, where it comes out of nowhere, hits with the velocity of a Mac truck, is massive and nothing can be done to save the person, no matter what. The heart can literally, explode. Or, a aorta can 'blow' and the person bleeds to death in three to five minutes. Or a massive stroke or hemorrhage will finish them off quickly. There's something to be said for a 'swift' death and Pluto helps make that possible. I'm not for slow, lingering deaths, thank you very much.
A good sign of longevity is a conjunction, sextile or trine between one's Pluto and Sun; although the whole chart must be taken into consideration for this.
Mars
Very often, Mars acts as a "trigger" for death or a near-death experience. It also rules knives, guns and fires. You will see an active Mars in a lot of "gang-banger" drive-by shootings. Mars is about a violent death of some sort and it can be by any of the above, or usually, through some kind of sport-related accident or a car accident. Mars rules mechanical things and machinery and often, people slice off a finger, get their arm ripped off in a combine, or are decapitated or lose a leg in an accident. Mars is one of the co-rulers of surgery, so any accident involving Mars can mean minor or major surgery, too. Since Mars rules anger, temper and male testosterone, these additions can make or break if there will be an accident or death--or not. If the person handles their Ego issues, turns the killing anger into some kind of positive use of it (instead of reaching for a gun or knife), then there can be a useful, productive outcome to this. Again, the choice is in the hands of the person concerned.
Deaths are usually violent and sudden and the person may die instantly (as in a bullet to the head) or linger on for a couple of days, and maybe a week--but no more than that. A Mars death is clean and swift.
Hades
This is one of the Uranian planets and is considered the planet of disintegration. Of what? It could take issue with a spiritual, mental or emotional concept or it could mean the physical body, too. Just depends. Hades is about "dust to dust." It's about the erosion and dissolving of an issue--either internal or external. It is about our past and the past coming up to stare us in the face of our present. How do we handle it? How do we handle the "can of worms" that Hades brings to us to look at. We must understand that Hades is not doing this to us--this is "garbage" we've repressed or suppressed within ourselves--all our ugly little feelings, our hatreds/prejudice/shame/loss of self esteem/humiliation/anger and the list goes on. It is Hades' job to dredge them up from our subconscious into the light of day of our consciousness. So what do we do when we stare at our own garbage in the mirror of our life? Some people "lose it" and go off the deep end. Some shove it back down, way deep, into their subconscious, thinking denial will do it. It won't. If you don't look at your own "garbage" then Hades will turn this festering mass of bad feelings and experiences into a disease--a chronic one--to get your attention so that you will handle matters in a more straight-forward fashion. And if you don't, you will die of a chronic disease, instead. Again, the CHOICE is yours to make. The flip side of Hades is therapy and shamanic healing or ceremonial healing of some sort from antiquity--which can help save your life and get you back on track with yourself.
A Hades death is slow, arduous, a cell at a time and can take a decade or more to slowly erode and dissolve the walls/cells/bones of our body until there's very little left. AIDS is a good example of a Hades disease.
Admetos
This is another Uranian planet. For those who love to suppress/repress their hard feelings, their hard knocks in life, their bitterness, their bad luck, their trauma, their PTSD, and shove it way down deep, is doing an Admetos response. Admetos has an affinity for the Moon and is often seen as the other symbol for the mother. It is also about our subconscious. In its most lurid form, the monsters and the Shadow within ourselves is mirrored by this planet.
Very often, with a strong Admetos natally in one's chart, this can mean that a "photograph" of a trauma occurred very early in life--especially in utero--while being carried by Mom--and it stains the person's entire life-force. The joy is to then is to first, identify it, and secondly, to work through it. Admetos is hard to detect and is a lot likeNeptunein some ways, but is darker and deeper and not as easy to access.
This planet rules strangulation of the person. The person suffocates in some way. It could be due to an overdose of prescription, over-the-counter or other drugs, inhaling poisonous gas of some kind (think of freon from the refrigerator, natural gas, etc.), being poisoned by drinking water that it tainted (think of lead poisoning here), or inhaling poisonous air that accumulates and you get sick and die from it.
Admetos is about the hidden, poisonous things in our everyday environment that can potentially kill us. And these aren't obvious things, either. Think of the Uranium deposits beneath your house and you get Radon gas poisoning--that is truly Admetos at work. Think of buying a house that used to be a hazardous material land fill--but you don't know that--and you and a number of members of our family end up with some rare form of cancer, as a consequence.
Also think of inhaling any poisonous gas--like mustard gas, Sarin, a nerve gas or think long the lines of those Gulf War vets who know have diseases from biological warfare--all of it hidden, under wraps and deadly to those who unknowingly and unwittingly inhaled it, drank it or had it on their skin and it was absorbed into their body.
Admetos means death by slow, gradual onset and poisoning. The only question is: where is it coming from? And what is it? It will take true detective work to find out who, what, when, why and how with Admetos.
An Admetos death can take years, if not a decade. And the person suffers enormously over time, if the source of the poisoning to them is not identified. A person slowly being poisoned by arsenic being put in their food daily, is a good example of this--a lotta liver pain, a lot of suffering, but its slow and unmerciful.
North and South Nodes
The Moon's Nodes are intimately concerned with the forging of connections and the dissolving of connections. These connections are with other people, places, associations, groups, your company/corporation and possibly, the country you live in.
We are constantly cutting ties and making new ones. The North Node is about creating new ties. That can be seen as dying and going to a more ethereal place of existence. The South Node is about creating old connections with old, familiar places, people or things.
They will be active in a marriage, in a divorce, in a birth, in a death, in the creation of a company, or the dissolvement of a corporation or country.
They are said to be one's "karma" but frankly, everything in your chart is your "karma"--not just the Nodes! To pick them out and say this is it, I believe, is very short-sighted. Our entire life is our karma.
Chiron
Chiron is the gatekeeper. He is often active when a person takes on a dis-ease in order to move and learn deeper, more enriching enlightenment about one's self or others. Around age 50, many people will take on a dis-ease. This is not to say they are bad people. No, not at all. There are hidden blessings in disease and I've seen Chiron act like a 'fast track' to spiritual evolution for a person when this happens.
Chiron can figure in the death of a person too--on any and all levels: spiritual, mental, emotional or physical. It just depends upon what CHOICES you want to make as to how you will use the life-changing Chironic energy, that's all. If you use it positively, then you will go on a shamanic type of learning path: the wounded healer. But you WILL survive it.
A Chiron death can be quick and merciful or drag on forever; and much depends upon aspect to it from other planets.
Venus
When someone is in the process of dying, I always like to see one of two planets around, Venus or Jupiter. They are both "guardian angels" of a type; although Jupiter's other side can be heavily involved in a death. Venus promises no suffering, or a very short period of suffering. There is grace with this planet when it comes to dying. It says that the dying will be "easy" or painless or less of something other than it could have been. Venus is sometimes seen in deaths where the person dies in their sleep.
I like to see Venus around because the person sees their journey into death as something beautiful, creative and an opening, not an ending or a closing or a loss.
Jupiter
It's amazing what good press coverage Jupiter gets, but I can tell you from the medical perspective, Jupiter is the pits. I often see Jupiter involved in aggressive cancers where there is cellular regeneration at optimum, and tumors are present, or an aggressive lymphoma. Ailments involving the liver can also come from this planet, as well. Tumors are Jupiter's "thing." It is also, by co-rulership of the liver, tied into the lymphatic system as well which is why, in many forms of cancer and dying of cancer, the Jupiter is active by transit or progression.
On the other hand, Jupiter is also the "guardian angel" aspect and I like to see it around when a person is dying, provided it is in good, soft aspect at the time. If it is, it means a gentle, non-struggling death. Transit is easy and comes all at once, although the person may linger for days, weeks, or even months. With a good Jupiter aspect around a the time, the person does not suffer one-tenth as much; and that's good news. They will also have a wonderful, optimistic, open attitude about their passing into the next world. Typical of a Sagittarius frame of mind, they see it or perceive it as their "next adventure" and they are truly looking forward to it. Death is a joy for them and they make it easy on those they are going to leave behind.
Poseidon
This Uranian planet is very often involved in a death aspect. One wouldn't think so, but it is, or at least in the charts I've seen over the years. When you think about it, having Poseidon around when you die, is the perfect close to one door and the opening of another.
Poseidon was the God of the Ocean. Consider it a higher spiritual octave ofNeptune. Consider it the "master" if you will, theNeptunepeople the "initiates." This planet is about TRUTH. Truth or lies, depending upon the person, their energy and where they are at in their spiritual evolvement.
People who have Poseidon active at the time they die have seen their personal Truth. By dying, they receive illumination during the death transit. Frequently, I see Poseidon active in slow, gradual deaths. And it is only when the end has finally come, that this planet makes its final station, that the person gets some kind of incredible, soul breakthrough. A great, wonderful, Cosmic "aha!" is the blessing of Poseidon.
Sun
Yes, our own Sun can be intimately tied into our death time. It should be, because the Sun is the epitome, the bottom-line of ourselves for this lifetime. Remember, the two big "triggers" in progressed charts is your Mars and Sun. I see the Sun in usually, older people's charts, and it truly is their time--they've learned all they could for this life (and they usually have) and now, it is a window of opportunity to go out on.
Many times, in many deaths, the Sun is not prominent. I see this as an "early option" of leaving because things were either learned more quickly than anticipated by the soul, or the person had made too many choices and was way off track from what they had wanted to learn and there was no way to back track to get on that path again. With the Sun involved, it usually means the person has truly fulfilled all there soul desires this time around and it is a natural time to move on.
A Sun death can be slow or quick. Usually, there is some beautiful gift of awareness, a deeper soul connection made with the self before passing--a gift is given because these people have earned such grace by working hard, being responsible and shouldering the loads they came in to carry and learn from or give back to humanity in the balance of their unique karma.
As you can see, many planets can play a part in death and dying. All of them do. You cannot look at just one planet, one aspect or one configuration--it is the culmination of all of them that must be looked at in totality. And even then, if the person decides to utilize this death energy on another plane of expression--and 75% of the time they do--well, they'll keep on living and breathing and being around for some time to come!
Hi, first off, there is so many ways a death can be read in a chart, but its also contridictorial. meaning, one configuration in a chart, can mean a totally different theme in circumstances at the moment of death. Its basically hard to predict unless you have the right tools, and I assure you, they are different then what clear cut, say a planet most often aspecting another in a malefic planet, dealing with the statistics of similar death instances. It is defiently circumstantial, not all patterns of similar deaths denote thats how you die, if its hitting a senstive configuaration. There is a way to get close to the answer, that is the understanding and intepretation of the hyleg, and the Alchocoden. But dont ask me, about that one, I didnt research on that one, anyhow, to learn more click below on the link, hopefully you will find out what your looking for. Also here is a 14 page article on death and astrology on a whole diferent note.
http://gonzo3.homestead.com/death1.html
Death Aspects in Astrology
Copyright ©1998 Dr. Eileen Nauman, DHM (UK).All Rights Reserved.
I'm sure just the title of this article will probably make it one of the most sent 'round the Internet articles of all time. Everyone is fascinated and repelled by death. Most people are repulsed and frightened that someone could predict their time of death and so, will read this from a macabre standpoint even if it scares them out of their wits. I'll warn you ahead of time, this will be a tongue-in-cheek article to an extent, although the information is viable.
Let's establish some ground rules here. I've been a medical astrologer since 1975 and I deal in sickness and death. I'm interested in dispelling some of the myths about what astrology can and cannot do -- especially in the realm of predicting one's death. Since I work in a rarefied field known as medical astrology, I see a lot of chronic illness and my fair share of dying and death along the way--the two are compatible and natural. Here's what I've found so far:
Myths that seem to just perpetuate regardless... about death and astrology...
1. Any astrologer who says they can predict your time of death is dead wrong. Get rid of 'em. Fire 'em. They're on an Ego trip at YOUR expense (literally and figuratively because you're paying money to this person to tell you such things). They are scaring you, manipulating you and you should get good and mad at them, report them to a national astrological organization and leave their services--pronto. No human being can tell you when you're going to opt out of this bag of bones and skin--only your soul knows that.
2. Don't ask any PROFESSIONAL astrologer to tell you when you're going to die. First of all, a professional will tell you up front they can't do it. Secondly, if they have a moral compass and integrity, they wouldn't tell you even if they did know! Why? Because your time of death is in YOUR hands, not the astrologer's. And hopefully, your astrologer has the wisdom and humility to admit this to you up front. and no astrologer is clairvoyant enough to see such things. Clairvoyance is highly dependent upon choices made by the person--not the astrologer. If clairvoyancy was all it was cracked up to be--then a clairvoyant would be accurate a hundred percent of the time, all the time--but they ain't. Why? Because of choice you plugged in, changed or modified through your own soul/sub-conscious.
I've been offered thousands of dollars to do just that from time to time--and I turned down all requests. I've heard some pretty persuasive arguments as to why I should tell what I know (and this is after telling the individual I could NOT point to the day of the death). One client said it was an investment in the future of his grandchildren--if he knew when he was going to die, he could set up his will at the appropriate time for them. Another was a husband who wanted to make sure his wife would be provided for--just in case something 'sudden' happened to him. I've had them beg, cry, plead, curse, threaten, lure and promise me many, many things over the years if I would only tell these individuals when they'd die. In every case, I've said "no."
3. You cannot "die" on a transit. I can't tell you how many frightened student astrologers who knew just enough to scare themselves silly, have called me over the years think that their 'death' was arriving shortly in the form of a heavy transit from Saturn, Uranus, Neptune or Pluto.
No one can die on transit. It has to be backed up in the progressions, firstly. And there may be 'other' indicator present, such as an eclipse, plus a transit. These two or three pieces to the recipe for Death must be in place before something serious and major happens. Nothing major happens on a transit. Everything major occurs with progressions.
4. And no, Saturn isn't the only death planet indicator. It is one of many, as you will see. Any and all the planets, including the Uranian ones, can be involved in a death.
5. And no, just because you have a transit, progression or eclipse in your 8th house (known as the house of sex, taxes and death, thanks to Scorpio ruling it), does not mean you're gonna check out either. Any house in the natal chart, any of the twelve, can be implicated and involved in your death.
6. And no, it isn't just hard aspects such as a conjunction, square, inconjunct or opposition that can put you into another dimension. So can soft aspects such as a sextile and trine, too. And there isn't one aspect that is a 'death aspect', either.
7. Eclipses are not going to kill you. In and of themselves, they never will. In order to die, you must have progressions set up. An eclipse MIGHT be a trigger for this to occur, but that is all.
8. There isn't just one death aspect opportunity in your natal chart--there is, roughly 4-8, depending upon the individual. I'm sure that won't help some people sleep well. "Gee, I have eight opportunities to die instead of just one....." and I can see the wheels turning on this one as to how to find them and when are they gonna happen?
9. Lately, Chiron is getting a myth started on this asteroid that it's Death's Door. No, it isn't. A Chiron transit can certainly bring transformation--but it doesn't mean dying physically.
10. The Moon's Nodes are the major indicator of dying. Not really. They may or may not be implicated in a death. In my work, they are so wishy-washy along this line that I look at them only as a secondary or third party in such crisis. I've found them 'active' in potential physical death only about 30% of the time--and that's not a very high statistic to count on.
So, those are the myths. And please (please) don't go around using them as death indicators because they won't work.
Some observations and experience...
I like to look at potential death aspects as windows of opportunity. Because people have set upfour to eightdifferent windows when they can die, it's hard for an astrologer to pick which one you are going to choose to leave on.
In our business as medical astrologers (and my associate, Rosemarie Brown will also parrot this), we like to use 'terms' that don't stampede our clients. Terms such as "window of opportunity" or a "crisis." Crisis simple means the energies come to an apex or focal point to physically occur and manifest--that does not mean dying!
Look at death as the following: consider the chrysalis of a butterfly. We live in a chrysalis, this human body of ours, this bag of bones we call "home." Death liberates and frees us, like a butterfly emerging from this cocoon, so that we can literally, fly free.
Death, in our business, is a window opportunity just like a birth is--there is no difference. In one, the spirit is being placed in the chrysalis (birth). In the other, the spirit is being freed of this chrysalis (death). Ask your astral body which it prefers and it will unequivocally tell you it prefers to be out of your bag of bones you call home!
We call these times in your progressed chart "windows of opportunity." Now, the only question we have to talk to you about is this: what is going to die? We know it will either be a spiritual, mental, emotional or physical death. Right there, it's a 4:1 odds against us choosing if you're going to leave your home for good or if there's an attitude that is outdated, worn out and an "old tape" from childhood that will die a death, instead. Or, maybe it's an emotion from the past that you've finally matured beyond and it's time to put it out of its misery, instead. Perhaps the belief system you were imprinted with as a child, has outgrown you and now, you're ready to embrace a different belief system--so the old spiritual cornerstone dies to leave a place for a newer, better model, instead. This is why an astrologer cannot accurately predict your time of death--this energy may well play out spiritually, mentally or emotionally instead--and you're still breathing after it occurs!
We may also call these windows "a crisis." There are any number of crisis in your life. You'll lose count. I know I have. A crisis simply means that something is coming to a head; the pressure is on and something is gonna move come hell or high water. And "something" will. One of the many possibilities is dying; but it's pretty remote on a scale of 1 to 10.
The Truth About Death Aspects
Now that we've swept away the myths and the old wives tales about being able to predict one's death via astrology, let me share with you what I do know, that is accurate and that does work.
1. ANY planet can be involved in a death aspect.
2. ANY aspect can be involved in a death.
3. Progression is 'where the action is at' and the windows of opportunity or crisis will certainly emerge.
4. There is no ONE signature for death. There are so many I could write a book on them (and I'm not going to), the possibilities endless (just as human beings are individualized, so are their deaths), that even when I see a strong window/crisis, I know that the soul of that person can take that energy and its eventual manifestation and expression and turn it into some kind of incredible, transformative opportunity.
Some Examples of Death
From my files, I make "notes" on things. Hen scratchings would be another way to look at it. As a medical astrologer, I'm a junkyard dog from the standpoint that I do not use one system. Typical Gemini/Pisces that I am, I use what works for me and this is the framework of what we are going to related and speak within.
First of all, I use Tropical astrology with a Koch house system. For progressions, where the real action is at, I use the 90-degree Cosmobiology wheel. I progress with average solar arc. I add the Transneptunian or Uranian planets. Their names are: Hades, Admetos, Kronos, Poseidon, Zeus, Apollon, Cupido and Vulcanus. Many of you may recognize these as Greek myth figures--which they are.
Midpoint structures are crucial. Without them, I couldn't do the type of work I do. With this "recipe" I have a 95% accuracy on forecasting health/medical events. In my business, you want accuracy above all because I'm dealing with serious dis-ease and potentially life/death situations or implications.
It is from this amalgam that I'm going to share some notes on deaths that actually took place. I'll make the appropriate comments after I share the particular aspects are shared. These two charts I have, over the years, lost the birth data--so please don't ask for it--and these are "hen scratchings" about the cases and the aspects/midpoint structures I found at the time of the occurrence. Both these cases were back in the early 70's--a long time ago, but they fit the bill with what I want to share with you in this article, regardless.
Case Number 1
This individual is of a man who had an argument with his wife. He was 24 years old when he died. He and the wife climbed into a jeep and he drove off at high speed. The jeep over turned and killed both of them. Just for clarification for our beginning/budding astrologers, I'm going to be using the following "shorthand" : P. means progressed planet. T. means a transit (daily movement) of a planet. N. means a natal planet in that person's chart. It takes a combination of a natal planet being "triggered" by a progressed planet (figured out with solar arc) and a transit(s) to be the catalyst to create action or an event/crisis/window of opportunity.
I'll be talking about Uranian Planets (yet another article in and of itself--but we will be tackling these on astro weeks in the future in the medical astrology portion).
Here are the aspects for the male that set up at the time of his death:
P. Midheaven
N. Hades/Venus ----------N. Uranus
Comment: This particular midpoint has the man's MC or Midheaven sitting between his Natal Hades and Venus on one side of the 90-degree dial and his Natal Uranus on the other side.
Interpretation: N. Venus/Hades--this person is going to have some love-life and love related problems that need to be disintegrated (Hades) so that it can be solved or resolved. A person's Midheaven is their Ego (outer/conscious) and how they want others to see them. If the Ego gets stepped on the wrong way, projections abound as a result. Uranus is about sudden things happening. They can be catalytic. They can be accidents (but it will be a strange, twisted kind of accident--a 'dumb' thing or 'weird' thing that occurs). Uranus rules over airplanes and flying. As I understand it, the jeep rolled off a cliff and 'flew' about three-hundred feet before hitting the bottom.
This guy was having love-relation problems that came to a head suddenly and he got is Ego bent out of shape and he went and did something stupid--like driving off at high speed while angry.
N. Uranus
N. Saturn --------P. Midheaven
The natal Uranus is at the midpoint between his natal Saturn and his progressed Midheaven.
Comment: Something catalytic and sudden/unexpected could happen (Uranus) and it hit old patterns of behavior and old ways of reacting/responding (Saturn) and his Ego (Midheaven) got pulled into this. He had a choice as to how he responded. Instead of a mature (Saturn) response, he went into his rebellious teenage temper tantrum (Uranus) and did his Ego trip thing. It got him killed, as a result.
Interpretation: There was lots of choices with this particular midpoint structure. He was given the opportunity to approach this love-relationship problem maturely (Saturn) but he CHOSE (see, there's that word again....) instead, to become rebellious (Uranus) and "I'll show you" (Midheaven).
N. Vulcanus/Node
N. Saturn -------------P. Pluto
This midpoint structure has Vulcanus (volcanic) and the nodes (north and south) sitting in the middle of it. Natal Saturn is on one side and progressed Pluto, on the other side.
Comment: Whatever was going to happen, was going to be "big" because Vulcanus is equated with a "volcano" exploding. The explosion, however, is defined. Vulcanus acts like an "adverbial" function to whatever it aspects. What does this mean? It means instead of having a Nodal energy of 1, it is 10. So that means that connections, either new connections (north) or dissolving of old connections (south) were highly emphasized in his chart for that night. With Natal Saturn, it was hoping he'd choose the mature avenue or approach to this. Saturn is often about endings, too. Or creating boundaries within which to operate. It is about restrictions. Pluto is about transformation.
Interpretation:: This guy had a real chance to make a break through that night. What was his choice? Breakdown. Of course, breaking down creates a break through, also. Maybe not the one you and I would have chosen--but we get choices thrown at us 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. His choice was to "explode" in this argument with his wife. He chose to transform the situation by leaving it--permanently. Of course, he could have broken it up (Nodes and Saturn) permanently by making some changes (Pluto) for his wife or their marriage. Vulcanus was asking him to transform (Pluto) the relationship (Node) for good (Saturn) and put it on a new and better footing. For whatever reason, he didn't choose to utilize the energy in that expression. He chose another expression of it: blowing up (Vulcanus), and transforming (Pluto) himself and his wife with finality (Saturn).
N. Vulcanus/Nodes
N. Hades/Venus ----------------N. Mars/Pluto
Comment: Here we have Vulcanus and the Nodes at the midpoint of his natal Hades/Venus (problems in love life) and natal Mars/Pluto tied up into this "dance." To be sure, there was going to be a catalytic (Pluto) explosion (Vulcanus) regarding a relationship (Venus/Nodes) that could end with a loss of one's temper (Mars/anger) that would lead to disaster (Hades).
Interpretation: There is no doubt that connections (Nodes) with people, in this case, his marriage, was going to undergo some powerful, transformative (Pluto) changes. It did involve his love life (Venus) and instead of using Mars as a directed energy of change, he chose to mirror the anger aspect of it instead (Mars). Consequently, he blew up (Vulcanus) in a temper (Mars) and hopped into his jeep (Mars) in an ugly, vile mood (Hades) and killed himself (Nodes/Hades/Pluto) and his wife (Venus).
P. Ascendant
N. Mars ---------N. Pluto
This is the man's ascendant which is about the people around him in his life at the midpoint structure of his natal Mars and natal Pluto.
Comment: Our Ascendant is our "overcoat"--it is our Persona or mask that we wear to the outside world. It is not our private self (that is our Moon), nor is "us" (that is our Sun). It's a facet or mask of ourselves that we feel comfortable wearing when we feel vulnerable, threatened or feel that we need this "shield" out in front of us to make us feel okay in a certain situation. The ascendant mirrors the people around us and in our life, in general. It can be our co-workers, the stranger on the street we pass, the person we ride next to on the subway, etc. With Mars and Pluto involved, this is showing us that someone around him (in this case his wife) is asking him to make some changes in himself. The question is: will he? And how?
Interpretation: The people in this guy's life were actively (Mars) asking him to change (Pluto). Whether he does or doesn't, is a choice he has to make. Whatever his wife said to him, triggered him off in such a way that he made several very bad choices down the line that got them both killed. His choice in this situation was not to actively (Mars) change (Pluto) but to end it (Nodes/Pluto/Hades) permanently.
P. Pluto
N. Hades -----N. Venus
We have progressed Pluto at the midpoint between his natal Hades and Venus.
Comment: This particular midpoint structure is asking him to change and transform (Pluto) a messy, deteriorating (Hades) marriage (Venus) and get it on the 'right' track instead or to sever (Pluto/Hades) the marriage/love relationship (Venus) forever (Pluto).
Interpretation: Its obvious to a professional astrologer that this midpoint structure is about how he feels/sees/regards his love-life and marriage relationship with his wife (Venus). It was in a state of gradual deterioration (Hades--"dust to dust") and that he was going to do something transformative (Pluto) about it. I don't believe he went into this argument with his wife with the intent of killing her and himself. I believe it got out of hand (Pluto) and he chose his destructive side (Hades) to "get even" with his wife for bringing up the ills of their marriage or things that needed to be repaired in their marriage to make it viable and ongoing between them (Venus).
N. Saturn
P. Mars/N. Pluto
This is an "opposition" on the 90 degree dial; or it appears to be and in "real life" on a 360 degree natal chart, it would involve a cardinal planet (Saturn) with two fixed planets (Mars/Pluto) and in actuality, could be a square aspect. But on a 90-degree dial, they show up as an "opposition". The man's natal Saturn is in a powerful opposition energy with progressed Mars which is conjuncting his natal Pluto simultaneously.
Comment: Any time we want to see "where the action is" in a person's life, we always look at the progressed Sun and Mars. These two planets (luminary and planet) are the key "triggers" to very important life choices and changes. It doesn't necessarily mean death and dying--one of these is always present in major life events/crisis, from getting a job, a birth, a death, a change of fortunes, a move, etc.
This young man came in and set up this situation; this tension between his natal Saturn and Pluto to see if he could master, overcome and work through it in a more mature way this time. Or, perhaps, this was one of those windows/crisis points where he'd either accomplished all that he could in this lifetime, and he was opting out. Or, he was way off his life track that his soul wanted to learn, and was opting out early because there was no way to get back on track, at least in this life time, so his soul "pulled the plug" so he could leave, to start again, in another life down the line. Many possibilities are presented with this configuration.
Interpretation: I call Saturn-Pluto the "put up or shut up" time in our lives. We all own this in one way or another. It's: "Lay your cards on the table, make your choice and whatever you choose--you're stuck with." Another way to look at this is: "Well, make a choice. Whatever it is, you lie in bed with it." (You made your bed, now lie in it). This doesn't have to be negative in the least. Saturn-Pluto is about make a powerful, slow, gradual evolutionary change at the soul level. Most of us do this without getting dramatic about it and flipping a jeep over and flying down a cliff and killing ourselves.
However, this young man chose NOT to act with maturity (Saturn) and decided to transform (Pluto) himself and his wife and it was expressed through anger (Mars) and testosterone (Mars/Pluto) in a very finalizing (Pluto) way.
You can see that ALL these aspects were in motion at the time of his death. You can also see that he had a lot of choices--and he made 'em. He had OTHER choices, too, that he disregarded. This could easily have been a powerful window of opportunity to transform his marriage. Well, what does that mean? It meant he could stay in the marriage, made the personal, transformative changes that were necessary to keep it viable OR he could get a divorce and go on with his life without her. It certainly did not have to end in death of both individuals. An astrologer would certainly have seen the 'crisis' in his chart and I'm sure, would have warned him beforehand of not losing his temper and being careful of accidents occurring. But to say: You're gonna die. No. None of us could have said with 100% finality--"Yep, this is your day to die, son." It was a day for him to transform, was all. The CHOICES he made, took it, in my opinion, to the "worst case scenario" instead of a more probable, hopeful, living outcome. Each soul has choices to make, however and we, as astrologers, certainly cannot know ahead of time if this guy was going to act like an infantile teenager with hormones/testosterone/hurt Ego and drive off like a maniac and get "even" with his wife in this argument. Those were all free will choices he put into play.
Case #2: Death of the Father in the Son's Chart
This particular case, the son was called by his mother that his father had passed away in his sleep. The mother had gone in that morning (they slept in separate rooms) to wake him up, and he was dead. Ultimately, the Sheriff suspected the mother of killing the father (she didn't) and an autopsy was performed to find out the cause of death (cancer) by the country medical examiner. Here's what the son's 90-degree dial solar arc progressed chart looked like that afternoon he received the call from his mother:
P. Saturn
N. Midheaven ---------N. Hades
Comment: Here we have two natal planets and you can see it is the progression that "triggers" off this event in the son's chart.
Interpretation: The MC (Midheaven), the Ego, the Self for this lifetime is engaged with Hades (dissolvement, "dust to dust"). Saturn, this time, becomes the Timekeeper (Father Time is one of his symbols) and in the son's chart is saying: something is coming to pass with finality. Time is up. It will affect the son directly (Midheaven). Interestingly, there was no love-loss between father and son, so when the son got the call, he was not in a state of grief then or later. The Hades in his chart was mirroring the dissolving of some THING in his life--and Saturn is certainly a symbol of the father in all our charts--or an older man (be it uncle, cousin, nephew, etc.).
P. Kronos
N. Saturn/Venus ---------N. Moon
Here we have progressed Kronos at the midpoint of the son's natal Saturn/Venus and his Moon.
Comment: Kronos is always about one's peer group. In this case, the sheriff's department, a government body, is stepping in. Kronos can also symbolize the father, since, in Greek mythology, Kronos was the father of Saturn. Usually it means a government body who has control or power with or over us (like the IRS, as an example). The peer group, Kronos is at the midpoint between the son's Saturn/Venus and his Moon.
INTERPRETATION: A government body was going play an important part in the son's life (Kronos). His mother (Moon) was thought to be a murderer (Saturn/Venus) and of course, this upset the son emotionally (Moon) a lot more than his father's passing. Someone he loved (Venus) was potentially going to prison (Saturn) and put there by the sheriff (Kronos).
P. Admetos/N. Node
N. Saturn/Venus
Progressed Admetos was conjuncting the Nodes in the son's chart and in 'opposition' was to this was his natal Saturn and Venus.
Comment: Admetos deals with hidden agendas, hidden things and information that is in the "dark" for a period of time. It was conjunct the Nodes (connections) and it mean that something that was in the dark, would be manifested by either a connection to something new (rebirth) or a loss of a connection (death). Added to this was an "opposition" to his Saturn (father) and Venus (love of mother). And also, his dealing with an unloving father (Saturn/Venus).
Interpretation: Admetos is like fog, or like the film that is being developed in the dark room of life. It is the subconscious, it is hidden, it is not obvious. With P. Admetos to the son's Nodes, it mean that a connection could either be forged (north node) or lost and disconnected (south node) and in this case, it was the mysterious passing (Nodes) of his father (Saturn) in his sleep (Admetos). And this passing involved a loved one (father and mother, although he said he did not love his father). The fact the father died in his sleep is very Admetos-like. The fact his father died of cancer, but it took an autopsy, is all about Admetos. Detective work of some kind may involve anything with an active Admetos in it, as it was in the son's chart.
The promise of a good outcome was the Venus in this configuration. Venus, in this case, promised a fortunate or happy end to a murky (Admetos) situation.
P. Sun/N. Uranus
Again, the main "trigger" planets, either the Sun or Mars, if involved in a progressed situation, means an important event that will alter the person forever, is going to occur. Many astrologers, looking at this, would predict an "accident" or "surgery" (Uranus) for the person who owned this chart (the son). However, it did not energy manifest in this way--and one would have to look at the above other configurations to perhaps come to a different conclusion. There was a "death by accident" here--but it was not the son--it was his father's sudden, unexpected passing, for no one knew he had cancer until the autopsy! The Sun/Uranus provided "surprises" for the son. It did not provide him an accident or surgery.
Planets Involved in Death
As you can see now, there are many types of "death" and that just because certain planets set up in configuration and aspect does not mean that the person is going to croak! As in the son's chart, it meant the death of the father in his life. The "death" of his emotional chasm with his father was passing. Now, the son would have to deal with a lot of suppressed emotions regarding how he felt toward his father. Nevertheless, it was an emotional death for the son, not a physical one.
In the other example, it was a physical death of the man and his wife. However, this could have played out much differently on three other levels, too. Choices that we make in an instant can change our lives on any one of these four levels, or, perhaps all of them. The key here is: choices are in our hands. Not the astrologer "reading" the chart.
Saturn
Saturn is often seen as Father Time--when your time's up--you're going. Father Time is here for all of us. We are all going to die some day. However, we move through many "mini-deaths" throughout our lives on the spiritual, emotional and mental level, too. And Father Time does erode our body so that when we're in our sixties, our body does not function as a twenty-year old's will, too. Saturn is about boundaries. You can either run into a brick wall, literally with Saturn, and kill yourself with it, or you can go around the wall, climb it or work through the wall, brick by brick. Its your choice on how you handle Saturn's energy.
A Saturn death is a lingering death. It doesn't happen quickly; it happens over time. Sometimes, a long, suffering time. Saturn is one of the planet's of longevity in one's life, also. The good side of Saturn, so to speak. A conjunction, sextile or trine between this planet and your Sun can give you a long, long life, although the whole chart must be taken into consideration for this.
Uranus
Uranus is implicated in surgery and accidents. Usually accidents of a "weird" or unusual nature--such as sky diving, bungee jumping, while you're skiing you run into and hit a tree and kill yourself--or some other loopy, dumb kind of thing that no one would ever think could happen and create an accident. Uranus also rules airplanes and flight--whether its in a single-engine airplane, a commercial jet, an ultra light or parachute/sky diving kind of "flight." It also rules over lightning and electricity--so many people get a jolt--either by a cord, by a lightning bolt or zapped through some strange, odd way. Surgery is co-ruled with Uranus along with Mars. With Uranus, you can have a "weird" car accident, or unexpected surgery (minor or major, depending upon the rest of the progressed chart).
A Uranus death is always sudden. There is no lingering on with this planet.
Neptune
Drug over doses, recreation drug death, death by Strep A flesh eating bacteria, by a nasty virus, or by prescription or over-the-counter drugs fall underNeptune's massive pervue. Drowning accidents figure prominently here, as well. Water related deaths or near deaths always find Neptune and Admetos active at the time. Of course, there is death by drowning of having too much fluid in your lungs; drowning by suffocation. Chronic Obstructive Pulmonary Disease, such as asthma, bronchitis, pneumonia and emphysema areNeptune's rulership as well. Anything having to do with water inside or outside the body isNeptune's base of operation. It could be a flood that kills someone. Or a flood of liquid, such as blood in the pericardial sac that surrounds the heart and stops the heart from beating. Deaths or near deaths that haveNeptuneprominently figured will always have a cloak of mystery about them, too. In some cases, no one will ever really know how it happened or what the person died of or from.
People with an activeNeptuneat the time of their death will usually die in their sleep (a lovely way to go). Or, they will die of suffocation (more than likely, lack of oxygen and perfusion, which means they simply can fall asleep and not wake up in this dimension again). A nice trine from one's Sun toNeptunemeans a quiet, gentle passing in one's sleep. No muss, no fuss. The "ultimate" way to go.
Pluto
Transformation is asked for by this planet. Can you change? If you can, you won't die. But you can die trying, too, although I've really not seen this with Pluto. There can be the slow death of an attitude, an emotion or feeling, of a spiritual way of looking at things, or a physical, bodily death. My experience with this planet is that if you're WILLING to transform/evolve/do the changes asked of you (and we're talking slow changes here--not immediate or abrupt ones as you'll find with Uranus), then Pluto is going to support you through this time period. You will come out the other end of a Pluto time older, wiser and better off. Or, you can dig in your heels, refuse to move/grow/transform and then Pluto will 'push back' and you can take off for another dimension--but again--it's your choice. Pluto deaths are usually pretty final and not always pretty. They usually involve massive trauma to the body, or there's little left to identify or its hard to identify.
Deaths with Pluto can be violent; and a good example of this is the heart attack, where it comes out of nowhere, hits with the velocity of a Mac truck, is massive and nothing can be done to save the person, no matter what. The heart can literally, explode. Or, a aorta can 'blow' and the person bleeds to death in three to five minutes. Or a massive stroke or hemorrhage will finish them off quickly. There's something to be said for a 'swift' death and Pluto helps make that possible. I'm not for slow, lingering deaths, thank you very much.
A good sign of longevity is a conjunction, sextile or trine between one's Pluto and Sun; although the whole chart must be taken into consideration for this.
Mars
Very often, Mars acts as a "trigger" for death or a near-death experience. It also rules knives, guns and fires. You will see an active Mars in a lot of "gang-banger" drive-by shootings. Mars is about a violent death of some sort and it can be by any of the above, or usually, through some kind of sport-related accident or a car accident. Mars rules mechanical things and machinery and often, people slice off a finger, get their arm ripped off in a combine, or are decapitated or lose a leg in an accident. Mars is one of the co-rulers of surgery, so any accident involving Mars can mean minor or major surgery, too. Since Mars rules anger, temper and male testosterone, these additions can make or break if there will be an accident or death--or not. If the person handles their Ego issues, turns the killing anger into some kind of positive use of it (instead of reaching for a gun or knife), then there can be a useful, productive outcome to this. Again, the choice is in the hands of the person concerned.
Deaths are usually violent and sudden and the person may die instantly (as in a bullet to the head) or linger on for a couple of days, and maybe a week--but no more than that. A Mars death is clean and swift.
Hades
This is one of the Uranian planets and is considered the planet of disintegration. Of what? It could take issue with a spiritual, mental or emotional concept or it could mean the physical body, too. Just depends. Hades is about "dust to dust." It's about the erosion and dissolving of an issue--either internal or external. It is about our past and the past coming up to stare us in the face of our present. How do we handle it? How do we handle the "can of worms" that Hades brings to us to look at. We must understand that Hades is not doing this to us--this is "garbage" we've repressed or suppressed within ourselves--all our ugly little feelings, our hatreds/prejudice/shame/loss of self esteem/humiliation/anger and the list goes on. It is Hades' job to dredge them up from our subconscious into the light of day of our consciousness. So what do we do when we stare at our own garbage in the mirror of our life? Some people "lose it" and go off the deep end. Some shove it back down, way deep, into their subconscious, thinking denial will do it. It won't. If you don't look at your own "garbage" then Hades will turn this festering mass of bad feelings and experiences into a disease--a chronic one--to get your attention so that you will handle matters in a more straight-forward fashion. And if you don't, you will die of a chronic disease, instead. Again, the CHOICE is yours to make. The flip side of Hades is therapy and shamanic healing or ceremonial healing of some sort from antiquity--which can help save your life and get you back on track with yourself.
A Hades death is slow, arduous, a cell at a time and can take a decade or more to slowly erode and dissolve the walls/cells/bones of our body until there's very little left. AIDS is a good example of a Hades disease.
Admetos
This is another Uranian planet. For those who love to suppress/repress their hard feelings, their hard knocks in life, their bitterness, their bad luck, their trauma, their PTSD, and shove it way down deep, is doing an Admetos response. Admetos has an affinity for the Moon and is often seen as the other symbol for the mother. It is also about our subconscious. In its most lurid form, the monsters and the Shadow within ourselves is mirrored by this planet.
Very often, with a strong Admetos natally in one's chart, this can mean that a "photograph" of a trauma occurred very early in life--especially in utero--while being carried by Mom--and it stains the person's entire life-force. The joy is to then is to first, identify it, and secondly, to work through it. Admetos is hard to detect and is a lot likeNeptunein some ways, but is darker and deeper and not as easy to access.
This planet rules strangulation of the person. The person suffocates in some way. It could be due to an overdose of prescription, over-the-counter or other drugs, inhaling poisonous gas of some kind (think of freon from the refrigerator, natural gas, etc.), being poisoned by drinking water that it tainted (think of lead poisoning here), or inhaling poisonous air that accumulates and you get sick and die from it.
Admetos is about the hidden, poisonous things in our everyday environment that can potentially kill us. And these aren't obvious things, either. Think of the Uranium deposits beneath your house and you get Radon gas poisoning--that is truly Admetos at work. Think of buying a house that used to be a hazardous material land fill--but you don't know that--and you and a number of members of our family end up with some rare form of cancer, as a consequence.
Also think of inhaling any poisonous gas--like mustard gas, Sarin, a nerve gas or think long the lines of those Gulf War vets who know have diseases from biological warfare--all of it hidden, under wraps and deadly to those who unknowingly and unwittingly inhaled it, drank it or had it on their skin and it was absorbed into their body.
Admetos means death by slow, gradual onset and poisoning. The only question is: where is it coming from? And what is it? It will take true detective work to find out who, what, when, why and how with Admetos.
An Admetos death can take years, if not a decade. And the person suffers enormously over time, if the source of the poisoning to them is not identified. A person slowly being poisoned by arsenic being put in their food daily, is a good example of this--a lotta liver pain, a lot of suffering, but its slow and unmerciful.
North and South Nodes
The Moon's Nodes are intimately concerned with the forging of connections and the dissolving of connections. These connections are with other people, places, associations, groups, your company/corporation and possibly, the country you live in.
We are constantly cutting ties and making new ones. The North Node is about creating new ties. That can be seen as dying and going to a more ethereal place of existence. The South Node is about creating old connections with old, familiar places, people or things.
They will be active in a marriage, in a divorce, in a birth, in a death, in the creation of a company, or the dissolvement of a corporation or country.
They are said to be one's "karma" but frankly, everything in your chart is your "karma"--not just the Nodes! To pick them out and say this is it, I believe, is very short-sighted. Our entire life is our karma.
Chiron
Chiron is the gatekeeper. He is often active when a person takes on a dis-ease in order to move and learn deeper, more enriching enlightenment about one's self or others. Around age 50, many people will take on a dis-ease. This is not to say they are bad people. No, not at all. There are hidden blessings in disease and I've seen Chiron act like a 'fast track' to spiritual evolution for a person when this happens.
Chiron can figure in the death of a person too--on any and all levels: spiritual, mental, emotional or physical. It just depends upon what CHOICES you want to make as to how you will use the life-changing Chironic energy, that's all. If you use it positively, then you will go on a shamanic type of learning path: the wounded healer. But you WILL survive it.
A Chiron death can be quick and merciful or drag on forever; and much depends upon aspect to it from other planets.
Venus
When someone is in the process of dying, I always like to see one of two planets around, Venus or Jupiter. They are both "guardian angels" of a type; although Jupiter's other side can be heavily involved in a death. Venus promises no suffering, or a very short period of suffering. There is grace with this planet when it comes to dying. It says that the dying will be "easy" or painless or less of something other than it could have been. Venus is sometimes seen in deaths where the person dies in their sleep.
I like to see Venus around because the person sees their journey into death as something beautiful, creative and an opening, not an ending or a closing or a loss.
Jupiter
It's amazing what good press coverage Jupiter gets, but I can tell you from the medical perspective, Jupiter is the pits. I often see Jupiter involved in aggressive cancers where there is cellular regeneration at optimum, and tumors are present, or an aggressive lymphoma. Ailments involving the liver can also come from this planet, as well. Tumors are Jupiter's "thing." It is also, by co-rulership of the liver, tied into the lymphatic system as well which is why, in many forms of cancer and dying of cancer, the Jupiter is active by transit or progression.
On the other hand, Jupiter is also the "guardian angel" aspect and I like to see it around when a person is dying, provided it is in good, soft aspect at the time. If it is, it means a gentle, non-struggling death. Transit is easy and comes all at once, although the person may linger for days, weeks, or even months. With a good Jupiter aspect around a the time, the person does not suffer one-tenth as much; and that's good news. They will also have a wonderful, optimistic, open attitude about their passing into the next world. Typical of a Sagittarius frame of mind, they see it or perceive it as their "next adventure" and they are truly looking forward to it. Death is a joy for them and they make it easy on those they are going to leave behind.
Poseidon
This Uranian planet is very often involved in a death aspect. One wouldn't think so, but it is, or at least in the charts I've seen over the years. When you think about it, having Poseidon around when you die, is the perfect close to one door and the opening of another.
Poseidon was the God of the Ocean. Consider it a higher spiritual octave ofNeptune. Consider it the "master" if you will, theNeptunepeople the "initiates." This planet is about TRUTH. Truth or lies, depending upon the person, their energy and where they are at in their spiritual evolvement.
People who have Poseidon active at the time they die have seen their personal Truth. By dying, they receive illumination during the death transit. Frequently, I see Poseidon active in slow, gradual deaths. And it is only when the end has finally come, that this planet makes its final station, that the person gets some kind of incredible, soul breakthrough. A great, wonderful, Cosmic "aha!" is the blessing of Poseidon.
Sun
Yes, our own Sun can be intimately tied into our death time. It should be, because the Sun is the epitome, the bottom-line of ourselves for this lifetime. Remember, the two big "triggers" in progressed charts is your Mars and Sun. I see the Sun in usually, older people's charts, and it truly is their time--they've learned all they could for this life (and they usually have) and now, it is a window of opportunity to go out on.
Many times, in many deaths, the Sun is not prominent. I see this as an "early option" of leaving because things were either learned more quickly than anticipated by the soul, or the person had made too many choices and was way off track from what they had wanted to learn and there was no way to back track to get on that path again. With the Sun involved, it usually means the person has truly fulfilled all there soul desires this time around and it is a natural time to move on.
A Sun death can be slow or quick. Usually, there is some beautiful gift of awareness, a deeper soul connection made with the self before passing--a gift is given because these people have earned such grace by working hard, being responsible and shouldering the loads they came in to carry and learn from or give back to humanity in the balance of their unique karma.
As you can see, many planets can play a part in death and dying. All of them do. You cannot look at just one planet, one aspect or one configuration--it is the culmination of all of them that must be looked at in totality. And even then, if the person decides to utilize this death energy on another plane of expression--and 75% of the time they do--well, they'll keep on living and breathing and being around for some time to come!
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Death By Astrology!!!
Original post: Rin Daemoko
Peoples lives are influenced by their birthcharts. Has anyone every thought to cast a deathchart, done at the time of someone's death to determine what their possible afterlife could be? I think it would be very interesting. For those who are comfortable with astrology, it could help to ease the passing of loved ones if they have an idea of what could be awaiting them. What is the viability of such a thing?
Peoples lives are influenced by their birthcharts. Has anyone every thought to cast a deathchart, done at the time of someone's death to determine what their possible afterlife could be? I think it would be very interesting. For those who are comfortable with astrology, it could help to ease the passing of loved ones if they have an idea of what could be awaiting them. What is the viability of such a thing?
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Original post: Venus666
would the astrological refrences be the same?
would the astrological refrences be the same?
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Original post: Dracophoenix
I've done that but the only eople I've known interested in their death, afterlife and future lives have been other occultists.
Most people ask questions like "Am I compatible with my partner?" when I answer something like if you have to ask the answer is no "Is he/she the one?" "What kind of job should I chose?" "what's my child going to be like?" and other questions regarding life. Some of these questions are questions if they actually listened to their intuition just for once they'd be able to answer their own questions.
I've done that but the only eople I've known interested in their death, afterlife and future lives have been other occultists.
Most people ask questions like "Am I compatible with my partner?" when I answer something like if you have to ask the answer is no "Is he/she the one?" "What kind of job should I chose?" "what's my child going to be like?" and other questions regarding life. Some of these questions are questions if they actually listened to their intuition just for once they'd be able to answer their own questions.
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Original post: Dracophoenix
I work with Eastern Systems and am learning Vedic Astrology. I ind it easier to use these systems for questions of a spiritual manner, time of death and what the after life and next life is gonna be like.
Anything can be found out through a person's chart. It's a matter of looking at the right influences in a person's chart.I look at the enire chart rather than a few planets and intitively interpret the whole picture for both past and future influences including after lives and future lives. That's how I'd do it
Think of looking at a person's future but go past their time of death. I hope that helps
I work with Eastern Systems and am learning Vedic Astrology. I ind it easier to use these systems for questions of a spiritual manner, time of death and what the after life and next life is gonna be like.
Anything can be found out through a person's chart. It's a matter of looking at the right influences in a person's chart.I look at the enire chart rather than a few planets and intitively interpret the whole picture for both past and future influences including after lives and future lives. That's how I'd do it
Think of looking at a person's future but go past their time of death. I hope that helps
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Original post: Rin Daemoko
I mean something completely different from using Birthcharts to predict time of death and nature of an afterlife. Birthcharts use the place and time of birth. What if you use the place and time of someone's death to look into the influences they'll have in an afterlife (if such things exist)?
Born: May 28th, 1937 @ 11:34 AM, New York City - used for Birthchart
Died: January 2nd, 2005 @ 9:16 PM, Toronto - used for Deathchart
I mean something completely different from using Birthcharts to predict time of death and nature of an afterlife. Birthcharts use the place and time of birth. What if you use the place and time of someone's death to look into the influences they'll have in an afterlife (if such things exist)?
Born: May 28th, 1937 @ 11:34 AM, New York City - used for Birthchart
Died: January 2nd, 2005 @ 9:16 PM, Toronto - used for Deathchart
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Original post: She Demon Wolf
It's certainly an interesting concept, but I'm wondering whether using the same house system would work, or whether there is another system readily avaliable to work off that does not involve the same influences as a birthchart.
I'm not making sense. Ick. Don't mind me.
[edit] I just googled for 'deathchart' without much luck, but something that came up was this :
http://www.evolutionaryastrology.net/board23.htm
(use Ctrl + F and type 'deathchart' to find the relevant bit). So, it's not what originally mentioned, but maybe it's a starting point. The link itself is not very clear, but maybe it's a start, especially the work with Pluto?
It's certainly an interesting concept, but I'm wondering whether using the same house system would work, or whether there is another system readily avaliable to work off that does not involve the same influences as a birthchart.
I'm not making sense. Ick. Don't mind me.
[edit] I just googled for 'deathchart' without much luck, but something that came up was this :
http://www.evolutionaryastrology.net/board23.htm
(use Ctrl + F and type 'deathchart' to find the relevant bit). So, it's not what originally mentioned, but maybe it's a starting point. The link itself is not very clear, but maybe it's a start, especially the work with Pluto?
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Death By Astrology!!!
Original post: Rin Daemoko
I used the free reading athttp://www.astrology.comto cast a hypothetical deathchart for George Harison using the following information:
Date of Death: December 30th, 1999
Approximate Time of Death: 3:30PM
Place of Death: London, UK
Section 1: How You Approach Life and How You Appear To Others
You appear gentle and soft, and you act rather reserved with others until you know them well and feel it is safe to be open with them. You have a strong need for emotional security and a sense of belonging, and are deeply attached to the past: your heritage, roots, family, cherished friends, familiar places, etc. Making radical changes or moves away from what is known and safe can be very painful and difficult for you. You tend to cling and hold on to people, memories, possessions of personal or sentimental significance. Having a home, a safe haven, is very important to you.
Section 2: The Inner You: Your Real Motivation
Serious, disciplined, and quietly ambitious, you are driven to prove yourself and to achieve material accomplishments and success. Your work, your position in the world, and your contributions to society are very important to you. You will persevere through enormous hardship and frustration in order to reach a goal you have set for yourself, and you often sacrifice much in the area of personal relationships and home life in order to do so.
Here is the actual chart.
I used the free reading athttp://www.astrology.comto cast a hypothetical deathchart for George Harison using the following information:
Date of Death: December 30th, 1999
Approximate Time of Death: 3:30PM
Place of Death: London, UK
Section 1: How You Approach Life and How You Appear To Others
You appear gentle and soft, and you act rather reserved with others until you know them well and feel it is safe to be open with them. You have a strong need for emotional security and a sense of belonging, and are deeply attached to the past: your heritage, roots, family, cherished friends, familiar places, etc. Making radical changes or moves away from what is known and safe can be very painful and difficult for you. You tend to cling and hold on to people, memories, possessions of personal or sentimental significance. Having a home, a safe haven, is very important to you.
Section 2: The Inner You: Your Real Motivation
Serious, disciplined, and quietly ambitious, you are driven to prove yourself and to achieve material accomplishments and success. Your work, your position in the world, and your contributions to society are very important to you. You will persevere through enormous hardship and frustration in order to reach a goal you have set for yourself, and you often sacrifice much in the area of personal relationships and home life in order to do so.
Here is the actual chart.
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Death By Astrology!!!
Original post: Dracophoenix
I work with Eastern systems vs western systems. I don't change a thing if I'm curious about a person's future lives or afterlife when looking at a chart.
I work with Eastern systems vs western systems. I don't change a thing if I'm curious about a person's future lives or afterlife when looking at a chart.
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Death By Astrology!!!
Original post: PatrickKelley
[QUOTE=Rin Daemoko]Peoples lives are influenced by their birthcharts. Has anyone every thought to cast a deathchart, done at the time of someone's death to determine what their possible afterlife could be? I think it would be very interesting. For those who are comfortable with astrology, it could help to ease the passing of loved ones if they have an idea of what could be awaiting them. What is the viability of such a thing?[/QUOTE]
Fascinating thought! You could start your own service doing that. My advicve would be not to concentrate so much on "what could be awaiting them", however, I would concentrate more on how their "Deathchart" might point out the various different avenues in ways that would be consistent with their personalities. In other words, what karma they take with them, and the ways they might use that, and their overall life experiences, to make their way toward a new after life, and possibly new incarnation.
[QUOTE=Rin Daemoko]Peoples lives are influenced by their birthcharts. Has anyone every thought to cast a deathchart, done at the time of someone's death to determine what their possible afterlife could be? I think it would be very interesting. For those who are comfortable with astrology, it could help to ease the passing of loved ones if they have an idea of what could be awaiting them. What is the viability of such a thing?[/QUOTE]
Fascinating thought! You could start your own service doing that. My advicve would be not to concentrate so much on "what could be awaiting them", however, I would concentrate more on how their "Deathchart" might point out the various different avenues in ways that would be consistent with their personalities. In other words, what karma they take with them, and the ways they might use that, and their overall life experiences, to make their way toward a new after life, and possibly new incarnation.
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Death By Astrology!!!
Original post: pAmphAge
It would be 100% pure fantasy and to *charge* for a service like this would be taking advantage of someone else's bereavement At least with regular Astrology there are many opportunities to test, verify, and improve the method at hand. How would that ever be possible with what happens after someone dies?
This is a great idea for a fantasy or horror short story, me thinks, but I'd call anyone who did it in real life a charlaton. There are other ways to help people through their bereavement--like teaching them to finding *meaning* in the person's death that will help them in their own life.
peace,
p/\mph/\ge
It would be 100% pure fantasy and to *charge* for a service like this would be taking advantage of someone else's bereavement At least with regular Astrology there are many opportunities to test, verify, and improve the method at hand. How would that ever be possible with what happens after someone dies?
This is a great idea for a fantasy or horror short story, me thinks, but I'd call anyone who did it in real life a charlaton. There are other ways to help people through their bereavement--like teaching them to finding *meaning* in the person's death that will help them in their own life.
peace,
p/\mph/\ge
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Occult Forum Archive
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Death By Astrology!!!
Original post: PatrickKelley
[QUOTE=pAmphAge]It would be 100% pure fantasy and to *charge* for a service like this would be taking advantage of someone else's bereavement At least with regular Astrology there are many opportunities to test, verify, and improve the method at hand. How would that ever be possible with what happens after someone dies?
This is a great idea for a fantasy or horror short story, me thinks, but I'd call anyone who did it in real life a charlaton. There are other ways to help people through their bereavement--like teaching them to finding *meaning* in the person's death that will help them in their own life.
peace,
p/\mph/\ge[/QUOTE]
I would have to respectfully disagree. Of course, there is always the potential for charlatanism, but that is true of anything. I can think of a lot of different ways in which this could be a valuable service, not only to the bereaved, but to the departed, and I mean here by assisting the dying person, on his deathbed, in preparing for the afterlife, by helping him or her to adjust to the prospect of life beyond death. I think Ren has hit on something that is potentially good, and I encourage him to follow through on it.
[QUOTE=pAmphAge]It would be 100% pure fantasy and to *charge* for a service like this would be taking advantage of someone else's bereavement At least with regular Astrology there are many opportunities to test, verify, and improve the method at hand. How would that ever be possible with what happens after someone dies?
This is a great idea for a fantasy or horror short story, me thinks, but I'd call anyone who did it in real life a charlaton. There are other ways to help people through their bereavement--like teaching them to finding *meaning* in the person's death that will help them in their own life.
peace,
p/\mph/\ge[/QUOTE]
I would have to respectfully disagree. Of course, there is always the potential for charlatanism, but that is true of anything. I can think of a lot of different ways in which this could be a valuable service, not only to the bereaved, but to the departed, and I mean here by assisting the dying person, on his deathbed, in preparing for the afterlife, by helping him or her to adjust to the prospect of life beyond death. I think Ren has hit on something that is potentially good, and I encourage him to follow through on it.