How do you deal With the occult and public life?

[Tyho]

Hi,

This is something I always found difficult to deal with, because I need to hide my passion of the occult in public and even to my family. People are just not receptive to this kind of ideas. I could be labelled a devil worshipper or worst: a nutjob. My boss at the pizza place I work is a devout Christian I simply can't imagine what he would do if he were to learn that I practice magick and try to invoke spirits in my free time. Perhaps he would try find a way to fire me.

I mean how do you deal with all that? Must the occult remain in your garden of secrets or do you share your passion openly and shamelessly?

I am curious to learn more about this.

[Desecrated]

In Sweden only about 5% are christians so it's pretty safe to be open about it.
If I lived in America, I would keep it quiet.

I don't talk openly about what exactly I'm doing, because I feel that it brings negativity to it (most of the time). So I keep my doings secret, but most people have a pretty good hunch that I practice.
And if you come to my house, it's kinda hard to miss.

[Ušušur]

Pretty much keeping it a secret. Where I'm from most of people are Christians (more than 85%). Even though some colleagues and friends are experimenting with tarot or crystals - for fun - I keep my beliefs and practice hidden.

Most of all, I have no need to share it with anyone. I feel comfortable having this 'garden of secrets', I mean, it's just who I am usually. A few times I engaged in conversation about Satanism, witchcraft, tarot, pagan beliefs in general and I learned it's best to avoid even discussing any occult-related things with someone who's not a practitioner.

If someone really wants to learn, s/he will find a way.

[Shinichi]

I don't really keep it a secret, I just don't advertise it. All my close friends know, but outside my inner circle, most people don't even know what I do for a living.

This generation is sadly used to over sharing, but consider this: Silence does not mean never talking about it, it simply means not talking to everyone within hearing range. It's not really an uber secret if you answer honestly when asked directly, but simply refrain from blabbing about it every chance you get.

Make a few real friends, who will accept you even if they aren't just like you. Look for a lover that has their own occult interests, so you can relate and work together. Build an inner circle where you can be yourself, and where it doesn't really matter what everyone outside that inner circle thinks of you.

Within discretion there is peace, but never be ashamed of being true to your nature.



~:Shin:~

[Deathquota]

Interesting perspectives. In my community, experimentation with the occult (especially with Eastern belief systems) is openly accepted. However, all beliefs are considered a personal thing that you shut up about lest you come off as a babbling idiot. People don't need to worry about being Wiccan or having occult symbols in public, unless near a religious organization. Except if you are a Satanist, then people will isolate themselves from you. In fact, the alienation from being labeled insane by skeptics seems much worse to me than being called evil by Religious people. Most people who I have met who have studied theology or philosophy have at least dabbled. My advice is the same as everyone's else pretty much. Learn to be honest and open to at least a few people, especially if you are obsessed with ideas like me. Oh, and oftentimes the conversation is easier to start as a philosophical one. If you are good at dialoging and are in an environment where you are respected, that will help.

[Rin]

I just say that I practice meditation and martial arts, and if asked about my religious/spiritual beliefs, I say that I believe in a higher power of some sort, but don't know it's exact nature - all of which is true and perfectly socially acceptable. I just don't go into the more esoteric side of my practices and beliefs with people unless I know they're open minded about such things.

[Desecrated]

Except if you are a Satanist, then people will isolate themselves from you. In fact, the alienation from being labeled insane by skeptics seems much worse to me than being called evil by Religious people.

A satanist who openly calls himself a satanist have no understood satanism properly. Only priests and teenagers does that.

[SerAlex]

Isn't it kinda a given that you'd not be able to be very open about something occult? I mean, that's literally what makes them occult since it means "hidden". But, I'm sure most of you know that.

As for actually opening up to people. Try speaking to them about various unrelated subject that may seem controversial. If they seem open-minded about those subjects, you might be able to tell them about something like occultism and you practicing it. Of course, some people are open on specific topics and closed on others, so even then it's risky. However, even once you've confirmed, it may still be hard to come out depending on who you are. I'm sure some people have hard times admitting stuff even when they know it's OK. Not implying you are, but you could be.

So, yeah, try that process.

[minervajane]

Interesting perspectives. In my community, experimentation with the occult (especially with Eastern belief systems) is openly accepted. However, all beliefs are considered a personal thing that you shut up about lest you come off as a babbling idiot. People don't need to worry about being Wiccan or having occult symbols in public, unless near a religious organization.

I want to move to where you are! Where are you, if you don't mind me asking?
I am in the southern U.S., where you do not talk about these things or you will be fired, you will be called insane, you will be called a devil worshipper, and anything else they can think of calling you or doing to you. I don't talk about my "things" to anyone around me. Thank goodness for internet forums! If I am specifically asked, I say I'm Buddhist. I've even had one person say I was condemed to hell for that. You could also say that you study kaballah or the ancient Jewish books. Most people around here don't even have clue about any of it...Jewish, Kabbalh, Buddhism, etc. I could say pretty much anything outside mainstream christianity and they will quit asking me questions.

[Desecrated]

It really depends on where you are.

Meditation, mindfulness, kabbalah and all that is seen no more insane then alternative medicine in Sweden. When I hurt my back last year the doctor recommended going to see a naprapat...
Yoga is valued no higher on the occult scale then zumba, aerobics and pilates.
Any sort of tai chi or qiqong is just seen as exercise. Martial arts are so common, nobody even lifts an eye about it.
I can have books about demons and the satanic bible at home and just say that I am interested in religion and philosophy and nobody really cares.
"I conduct esoteric studies" instead of "I practice the occult" goes a very long way.



And then you have places like Mississippi where they burn copies of Harry Potter.....

I saw a serious christian site that said you would go to hell for using tarot cards because they invoke demons and unholy spirits.
^^It's not even worth arguing with people like that, just smile and move along.



I use to work as a musician, we are allowed to be a bit eccentric. If I said that I work with tarot cards, nobody would really care.
IF I on the other hand was working at an office, especially at a higher up position, it could undermine me to talk about tarot and chakras.
If I was a football coach I would be very open with things like superstition and luck. Heck I might even get away with being religious.
If I was a school teacher, I would be very very quit about it.

Just like any occult and esoteric studies should be adapted to who you are as a person, it should probably be adapted to where you are, both in position and in social standing.
If you live in the sticks, go ahead and do some open air rituals.
If you live in the city, a walk-in closet is a good place to set up shop.

[Tyho]

Isn't it kinda a given that you'd not be able to be very open about something occult? I mean, that's literally what makes them occult since it means "hidden". But, I'm sure most of you know that.

Well, the things we are researching and experimenting with are 'occult', in the sens that the masses don't know about their intrinsic truth or they choose to dismiss it but it doesn't mean *you* have to be occult or hidden. If that were the case, if no one dared speak openly about such things there would be no books to read, except for a few initiated in secret circles, and no prominent occultists to draw inspiration from. Nada.

I think it's more the fear to be judged, marginalized or even discriminated for your beliefs and practices. I certainly don't want to be caught between the hammer and the anvil, on one side the rationalists waiting to call you a nutjob and laugh behind your back, on the other the religious folks trying to define you as a devil worshipper, some kind of 'bad' guy out of his way. But there are indeed people who rose beyond that, they fully assumed who they were and had to share what they knew. They could afford the repercussion. Many of us - simple folks working hard to get a paycheck - would have a hard time doing that.

Anyway, I've recently started to read The Secrets Of Dr John Richard Taverner by Dion Fortune which provided me with a better understanding of how to deal with these two positions in life, my public ''official'' self and my private life, my garden of secrets to combine the two in a productive and meaningful way. I highly recommend it. It can be downloaded for free here (the copyright expired in 1997):

http://darkbooks.org/pp.php?v=501190968

[grimmos]

this is how I deal with it lately

we are on a code green and orange my metal bug will be sent on a suicide mission going through people to the sun and 80,000 doors in Nanaimo have 3 issues of saw on the doors two in our mental health club club house garbage can in the office and 1 at the closed biker club house lol I just don't write the rules but through pain I spread the word

[Tyho]

we are on a code green and orange my metal bug will be sent on a suicide mission going through people to the sun and 80,000 doors in Nanaimo have 3 issues of saw on the doors two in our mental health club club house garbage can in the office and 1 at the closed biker club house lol I just don't write the rules but through pain I spread the word

You are not making any sens though. Unless I am dumb and simply don't understand. [confused]

[Atzmuth]

My friends think I am a satan worshipper.... Idiots.....

[Deathquota]

I want to move to where you are! Where are you, if you don't mind me asking?

I lived in the South for a while (Georgia). Yeah, there are a lot of fundamentalists.
Right now I live in the Twin Cities, Minnesota. Probably occultists can be considered idiots, if anything here.
I guess the inner burbs and city are mostly liberal. We have a passive-aggressive attitude in general.
Being "spiritual but not religious" is extremely trendy right now, especially if you are in college.
People in their middle age are also another huge audience. It seems that there is a surplus of ex-Christians.
It's almost exhaustingly common to me at this point when a friend says they are interested in buddhism (until they can display some understanding of it beyond just being in some spiritual phase).
I don't mean to demean you at all of course, you actually sound pretty experienced.

Just like any occult and esoteric studies should be adapted to who you are as a person, it should probably be adapted to where you are, both in position and in social standing.
If you live in the sticks, go ahead and do some open air rituals.
If you live in the city, a walk-in closet is a good place to set up shop.

Agreed. Where I live, I am lucky enough that there are some expansive public natural forested areas within the city bounds. I find myself constantly adjusting my behavior based on when these things change.